(Hopefully) definitive list of all operational deficiencies

[pgmetcalf]

An text box for inputting the values of height for gradient points is absolutely necessary

[jamespetts]

An text box for inputting the values of height for gradient points is absolutely necessary

It's not strictly an operational issue, though Perhaps it might be better suggested in this thread?

[jamespetts]

Update: I have now added a colour coded system to classify which problems are known to be fixed as of Upgrade 1, and to make it easy to see at a glance what problems have and have not been fixed. At present, we do not know a great deal about what will be fixed, so most of them are "status: unknown". As more information becomes available, I will update the statuses. I very much hope that I do not have to create a new status, "Issue introduced by Upgrade 1" (not least because I'm out of colours).

[AndiS]

I very much hope that I do not have to create a new status, "Issue introduced by Upgrade 1" (not least because I'm out of colours).

That's a bad design flaw in your colour system. There must be at least one issue introduced by Upgrade 1 -- it is a law of nature.

[jamespetts]

That's a bad design flaw in your colour system. There must be at least one issue introduced by Upgrade 1 -- it is a law of nature.

Ahh, hmm, but not necessarily a new operational issue, perhaps? In any event, how about fuschia?

[AndiS]

1:0 for James in the all important sports discipline of positive thinking!
So let's hope it is something that does not impact operation at all.

[jamespetts]

Update: Added Upgrade 1 information in respect of (1) selection of destinations; and (2) fixed timetables.

[jamespetts]

Update: Upgrade 1 was released yesterday, with 119 documented modifications. Of those, only the following eleven relate in some way to signalling/operations:

• Implemented the ability to pick scenario destinations via the 2D Map.
• Manual junctions will now be forced open if the player crosses against them, rather than causing a derailment (derailments still occur on manual slip junctions).
• Changed the occupation count for signalling regions to take account of consists which are dropped off or picked up.
• Removed OSS functionality from TPWS as only TSS is utilised.
• Fixed the issue of duplicate rail vehicles when reloading a scenario.
• Fixed a bug where trains entering a portal would cause the trailing signal to stay at Red.
• Fixed a bug which meant that the player was unable to complete the scenarios perfectly, even though all tasks were completed successfully and no minor operational errors had been committed.
• Fixed a bug where an AI with a physics model entered into a portal, the physics model remained.
• Fixed a number of bugs which would result in the user getting the operation error "Consist missing required elements" even if they arrived with all elements of the consist.
• Fixed a bug which could result in AI train derailments after saving and re-loading a scenario
• Fixed an AI bug which could occur if user saves upon reaching a destination, continuing would result in an AI collision with non-user trains,

and, of those, only the following six relate to the issues in this thread:

• Implemented the ability to pick scenario destinations via the 2D Map.
• Changed the occupation count for signalling regions to take account of consists which are dropped off or picked up.
• Fixed a bug where trains entering a portal would cause the trailing signal to stay at Red.
• Fixed a bug where an AI with a physics model entered into a portal, the physics model remained.
• Fixed a bug which could result in AI train derailments after saving and re-loading a scenario
• Fixed an AI bug which could occur if user saves upon reaching a destination, continuing would result in an AI collision with non-user trains,

although it has been discovered that there is an additional undocumented fix relating to AI train headlights. Of those documented fixes so far, two have been confirmed to work well:

• Implemented the ability to pick scenario destinations via the 2D Map.
• Fixed a bug where trains entering a portal would cause the trailing signal to stay at Red,

one has been found by my tests so far to have no effect on the critical issue to which it relates:

• Changed the occupation count for signalling regions to take account of consists which are dropped off or picked up,

and the rest I have not yet had a chance to test (some of them, such as the ones involving AI collisions that only occur when saving, would be very hard to test in any event).

By far the great majority of the issues (including all of the critical issues) remain outstanding and unfixed. I am in the process of updating the original list to take account of the information from the release notes and my testing. When further information is uncovered, I will update the list further.

At this point, does anyone think that there is any real prospect of the critical issues being resolved in the foreseeable future?

[jamespetts]

Update: I have now brought the original list up to date with what is currently known about Upgrade 1. Except where testing has shown to the contrary (so far, only in relation to AI headlights), I have assumed that, where an issue is not mentioned in the release notes, it has not been fixed. Where I have confirmed by testing that an issue has not been fixed, I have indicated that. Where the release notes hint that something might be fixed, but I have not tested it (saving instability, portal instability), I have left the fix value indeterminate.

An overwhelmingly high proportion of red "issue not fixed" notices does not make for good reading.

[CaptScarlet]

At this point, does anyone think that there is any real prospect of the critical issues being resolved in the foreseeable future?

Yes I do. Seeing as they are already talking / thinking about the next upgrade/patch then the chances improve that some of the items on your list will get fixed, now that the different versions are the same and a number of bugs have been fixed.

John

[shortbart]

Just one question to derek, and please don´t get angry I knwo my english isn´t perferct so sometimes it could be seen as unpolite but isn´t so sorry for that...

Is the Code of RS really so flexibel, that you can implement totally new features like (let´s dreaming ) track banking?

That is just a question for me to see what can be expect from Future Upgrades

[jamespetts]

Update: As is apparent from the colour-coded list, Upgrade 1 was not good for signalling. However, things may change in Upgrade 2: RSDL employee Derek Siddle (RSDerek) has recently posted to say that signalling will be a high priority for Upgrade 2, and that more details will be released soon. I will, of course, update this thread with those details as they emerge.

[BadWhippet]

Hello - my first post here. There seems to be a bit of discussion about what serious versus casual players might like/expect from RS, and the serious simmer guys are the main contributors to this thread. Well, I'm the casual gal! If RS is also being targeted at casual gamers, then I hope my bit will help. If it's not , please ignore.

I like RS greatly and have already bought every available pack that goes with it. I love the full 3D views, the real 'feel' of the trains (as far as they can feel real to a non-enthusiast) and how more involved I feel in driving the trains. It is a great, great product for the casual simmer, for sure. Congratulations from me!

But the lack of set timetable really, really matters and mars playability of the passenger scenarios particularly. I know this has been raised already, but I wanted to mention that this is huge to the casual gamer too. Without a fixed timetable, there is no 'challenge' to any passenger-train activity. You start the train, hope you don't crash or shoot any red signal, and then you arrive. That's it - end of scenario, no matter how late one arrives (makes the game feel very short-lived - not ideal when you want people to buy the expansion packs too). The problem is, with no timetable, there's no challenge, no need to do well, no real point beyond keeping to speed limits... I want to be given a fixed timetable then keep myself awake into the early hours trying like heck to achieve it. If I don't keep the timetable, then I should fail the scenario, or be given a bad driver record or something. For me, it's serious enough to blight the 'game' of the passenger scenarios.

However, the shunter and freight scenarios are great and I enjoy these hugely. These alone will keep me playing Rail Simulator, but I admit I do prefer the passenger scenarios of MSTS simply because of the need to keep to a fixed timetable. I really, REALLY want to see this in Rail Simulator. I hope one day it happens; after all, I'm not joining the you-WILL-buy-Vista campaign just to get MSTS2, so Kuju has me as a loyal player for quite some time to come!

[mauried]

A few comments re the AI Dispatcher.
I seriously doubt that this will ever be fixed simply because in a low cost PC game its just not possible.
The number of decisions and the pathing issues that any AI has to assess go up with approximately the cube
of the number trains that are running at any time.
In real life , whilst Computer aided Dispatchers exist, they are designed and coded for a specific track arrangement
and wont work on a totally unknown track arrangement.
A better option , rather than trying to make a Dispatcher that can handle any situation, would be to allow the player to also be the
Dispatcher, ie you can control the signals and points in a scenerio yourself , and the AI trains would respond accordingly.
If you try and make a Dispatcher that is fail safe , and wont cause crashes, you will end up with what MSTS had, signals at red for no reason.
This is one of the major problems that I forsee if the Sim goes down that road, defaulting all signals to red will invariably end up with trains hitting signals which are red for no obvious reason.

[jamespetts]

Update: I have now added initial information based on the release notes to Upgrade Mk 2 and some preliminary testing of that upgrade to the list: as will be apparent, few of the issues (and none of the critical issues) listed have any improvements. There is also one new issue introduced in Upgrade 2 (for which I have had to choose a new colour especially for issues introduced for the first time in upgrades), which has been assigned to the "sub-critical" category, although it is a serious one (reported on the official RSDL forums here).

If anyone has any new information about the items that I have not tested, or anything to suggest that I have made a mistake in the classification of any of the items, please post on this thread, and I will test/update the list accordingly.