New stock for the ECML?

karlrestall · Post by **karlrestall** » Thu Jun 07, 2007 1:54 pm

According to this source

http://www.forbes.com/markets/feeds/afx ... 94313.html

It looks like we will be seeing new stock on teh ECML before long. Such a shame the 125's are timeless and probably have many years left yet.

Regards

Karl

mattvince · Post by **mattvince** » Thu Jun 07, 2007 9:27 pm

Intercity Express Programme (IEP), formerly known as HST2. See http://www.dft.gov.uk/pgr/rail/pi/iep/ for the official low-down. In theory an 'HST2' could be a train to beat all others, but in view of the sheer incompetence of DfT, and the litany of failures of previous Government procurement programmes, many of us doubt it.

As to HSTs having many years left - unlikely: dump toilets and slam doors will see them sidelined quicker than you might like. The refurbishment has done some work towards life-extending them, but all the TOCs and ROSCOs agree that replacement within a decade is the only sensible solution.

Of course IEP begs the question - do we really need a new diesel train? Sure, biofuels can provide an interim solution, but what if an incoming Government decides, after the 2009 election, that electrifying the major HST routes is the only way forward? IEP will be able to go all-electric, but the specification seems to be written around diesel power @ 125mph. 'Pendolino II' is always an alternative...

jonhewes · Post by **jonhewes** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 9:03 am

My personal opinion is that Electric Trains should be purchased - be they loco hauled or MU, and then dragged around non electrified routes when required - aka Donny to Hull etc.

Virgin do it to Hollyhead each weekday with the Pendos.

Beetlejuice · Post by **Beetlejuice** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 10:39 am

I think defiently for the main route from King's X to Edinborugh ie GNER it should be an all new electric loco, with regentitive braking. I can't think though of what other competitors will want. FGW can't use electircs so maybe a DMU that can be made electric is the best solution though I'd prefer to see something like a pendolino with power at the ends rather than on each carrige.

allypally · Post by **allypally** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 11:43 am

Virgin are stopping doing it from Holyhead - all trains will soon be Voyagers.

Beetlejuice · Post by **Beetlejuice** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 1:29 pm

I didn't think they had enough voyagers to do the service they currently have let alone a differnet one.

allypally · Post by **allypally** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 1:38 pm

All West Coast cross country services bar trains to Manchester Piccadilly are being withdrawn.

Beetlejuice · Post by **Beetlejuice** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 3:07 pm

ah, intressting desisiion!

JSReeves86 · Post by **JSReeves86** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 3:25 pm

Bear in mind there is the upcoming shake up of XC etc so will be something to do with that.

JR

arabiandisco · Post by **arabiandisco** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 4:09 pm

I think part of the result will be that the XC vomiter fleet will all be 4 car, with the WC vomiters becoming 6 car.

Because the XC routes run at load factors of about 13% all day every day :/

allypally · Post by **allypally** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 5:10 pm

Ha. That's quite funny. 13%? you got to be joking.

arabiandisco · Post by **arabiandisco** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 5:36 pm

I was being sarcastic, as it happens.

Though a recent Virgin press release did state that "Due to passenger feedback, and the fact that we barely run to Dorset any more since the Poole service was cut back to Bournemouth, 220018 is to be renamed 'Overcrowded Voyager'. This will coincide with the introduction of Tokyo metro-style 'Packers' to assist our customers in boarding our trains"

allypally · Post by **allypally** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 5:51 pm

That's alright then - t'internet doesn't show sarcasm too well unfortunately.

enotayokel · Post by **enotayokel** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 7:43 pm

I think the reason for no more Dragging is that Alsthom have said that the warrenty on the pendo's could be invalidated as the provision was intended for diversions only

Interestingly the 4 car 221s were intended for the London to North Wales run, but some senior welsh polictical type wanted the pendo's hence the drags. And now West coast are getting the 5 cars.

BTW IIRC the 6th car (where added) is going to be First Class

PS: This is the DfT View

Capacity

The need to ensure suitable rolling stock capacity for the franchise, particularly in light of proposals to transfer the Super Voyager fleet to Virgin West Coast, was highlighted by 41 respondents. It was felt that all Voyagers should be specified as 5-car in length, as a minimum, and that additional rolling stock should be procured to handle the growing demand for capacity on the New Cross Country network.

DfT Response:

Bidders will be asked to submit options to deliver a 30% increase in capacity on the most congested sections of the franchise. Several rolling stock solutions to crowding and growth issues are possible and it will be for bidders to identify the most cost effective and practical solution.