Class 37 Brakes

GaryL · Post by **GaryL** » Sun Dec 14, 2003 1:40 pm

Hi folks,

Hoping someone can help here...

I'm having a slight problem with brakes on Class 37s when on freight trains. They seem to take forever to stop (even from, say, 20mph) and that's me applying the emergency brakes! They are fine on passenger coaches though! It's not just certain wagons that this is happening with, it's every freight consist. Other locos are fine.
Last week I was doing an explore route on London brighton with 37410+37421 (both EWS) on a full train of EWS FCA's. Nightmare.

I'm currently making an activity for Vern's West Highland Route in which you drive 37116 (Transrail)+37419 (EWS) hauling 6 or 7 Ferrywagon's and 3 OTA timber wagons on the rear and encountering the same problem with the brakes. At County March Summit you have to slow down to 30mph from 40mph for Horseshoe Curve but in the act I had the emergency brakes on then tried the reverser to reverse and was gradually gaining speed until I derailed at 50mph. You descend rather rapidly.

I'm hoping someone can help here. Any help appreciated.

Gary

baldwin · Post by **baldwin** » Sun Dec 14, 2003 3:38 pm

Make sure that your wagon and loco brake types are matched. I have just run 12 EWS FCAs with 2 of 37153. A 10% brake application with these brings me to a stand within half a mile from 60 mph. This is in fact a very short stopping distance from that speed, so the MaxBrakepower figures will need checking.

Mervyn

GaryL · Post by **GaryL** » Sun Dec 14, 2003 6:09 pm

I assume you mean MaxBrakeForce ?? If so, what should this be at?
I've matched the brake types and still no luck. Am I missing something completely obvious here?

Again, help appreciated.

P.S It's my WHL act with the Ferrywagon's and OTA's that are in question, not the FCA's.

Gary

bigvern · Post by **bigvern** » Sun Dec 14, 2003 6:11 pm

Not an expert on physics and certainly what's described doesn't sound right. However we have become rather imbued with the over efficient braking on some MTS traction units, so when we encounter a model with braking more akin to the prototype, it catches us out!

Don't forget some traction units won't allow partial release and moving the brake handle off initiates a full release.

GaryL · Post by **GaryL** » Sun Dec 14, 2003 7:49 pm

The problem has been partially solved - by only allowing one 37 on the train. Still doesen't explain the reason why 2 can't do the job though...

P.S The act should be released soon hopefully. Doing a bit of testing just now.

Gary

GaryL · Post by **GaryL** » Sun Dec 14, 2003 10:26 pm

May be a while yet before the activity is released because after 62 minutes of driving tonight, my train derailed at Gorton (6 miles from Rannoch, where I was due to cross a southbound train!) at 29mph on a 50mph spot. Conclusion - constant strain on the couplings due to constant climbing so the physics goes absoloute crazy. You probably all know from previous postings that the same problem occurs southbound at Corrour, however I've never known there too be a problem at Gorton...I do now!

Gary

bigvern · Post by **bigvern** » Sun Dec 14, 2003 10:38 pm

Just had similar problems testing 156 activities on Far North. MTS won't let you go from Wick to Thurso then back to Georgemas, reverse and on to Forsinard! I've reset the reverse point 3 times now but takes 40 mins or so of driving to test each time.

Think I'll now abandon side trips to Thurso and just run direct to/from Wick with maybe an odd trip from Georgemas for the branch.

Ref WH, yes it's very frustrating. If the break value on all the couplers is set for 9N then shouldn't be a problem, but I guess this is one issue we all wish MS had sorted out if we are going to be left with V1 until 2005 or whenever!

baldwin · Post by **baldwin** » Mon Dec 15, 2003 8:26 pm

Ok. I'll get a consist rigged like you are using and have a fiddle around.

Mervyn

47354 · Post by **47354** » Thu Dec 18, 2003 1:02 am

Bear in mind that one of the most commonly incorrect areas with loco physics is the rate at which the brakes come on and are released and the actual strength of the brakes thenselves; in real life the driver has to think ahead when braking, one of the reasons why route knowledge is so important.

GaryL · Post by **GaryL** » Thu Dec 18, 2003 1:11 am

Baldwin, how did you get on with double headed 37s on a freight? Brakes dodgy or OK? I hope it's not just me with this problem.

Single 37s are fine.

Gary

ianmacmillan · Post by **ianmacmillan** » Thu Dec 18, 2003 1:28 am

Check that the brake settings are all correct for air.

Some stock only have the name changed in route riter.
It should read

BrakeCylinderPressureForMaxBrakeBrakeForce ( 70 )

If its set to 21 you need to copy the settings from a correct vehicle.

baldwin · Post by **baldwin** » Thu Dec 18, 2003 8:24 pm

Gary

I made up a consist with the two locos, 6 ferry wagons and 3 OCA on the end. I made no changes to any of the eng or wag files, which meant that the lead loco was vac braked while the rest of the train was air braked. It ran OK and braked OK if a bit too hard for my liking. I havent had time to investigate the wag/eng files yet, will do it this weekend. Just a thought, send me your actual consist, and I'll test with that. The one I am using is probably not quite the same as yours.

Mervyn

FuNky2k · Post by **FuNky2k** » Sat Dec 20, 2003 4:21 pm

If you are using the "train" brake on a 37 you can only make one application and if you release it you have to wait for the main reservoirs to charge before you can apply again, so try not to use it like a car brake, apply once, then wait, you can apply again but if you release you will have nothing left to re-apply.

GaryL · Post by **GaryL** » Sat Dec 20, 2003 6:56 pm

I *think* I've got it.

Gary