Dovetail Games MML London Bedford Route

[rfletcher72]

MSTS and TS2015 aren't like-for-like, so there's no point in using one as a benchmark for the other...

I disagree. Seeing as many of us cut our teeth in the genre with MSTS (and some of us even earlier with Southern Belle), I often use the best and worst features of MSTS as a reference point when running TS. It serves to remind me just how far we have come over the space of maybe 10 years.

The emergence of TS routes that we also saw in MSTS provides, for me at least, an added weight to this. When GEML was released in TS and I first it ran end-to-end, it was like meeting an old friend again. Making Tracks Great Eastern route for MSTS is IMO still the best UK payware route available for that sim and it was nice to be able to compare the route over the two sims. The same goes for E to G and BML.

....or even Sheffield for Mr Fletcher!

I'll drink to that......

Richard

[rosgar]

Now that's the Midland Mainline!

[DocklandsProject]

As Farringdon is merely a through station shared with London Underground it would be extremely odd to feature it as a 'terminus'. Same with Blackfriars, the terminus platforms there are for incoming services from the south. What do you say on Moorgate as a 10/1 outsider. Now that would be fun with some LU stock as AI traffic.

[37114]

It was obvious this was coming at some point. Looks like it will be a modern day version which is a shame as I'd prefer old style St Pancras. Day one purchase for me as a former WHPSB bobby!

DTG don't make and have never made period routes. It's the current state of a route that offers them the "path of least resistance", especially when the route is something that has a minimum new-asset requirement like this one.

I'll probably get it just to see what the MML is like, but from what videos of the line I've seen on Youtube it appears to be a seriously boring route. It reminds me of the ECML, only with partial electrification and far less stock variety (or maybe that's just part of the route?). I don't know much about the line as it has never interested me much, but maybe it offers more on the Bedford section with the 319s and 377s?

Kev

They don't do period routes? Somerset and Dorset? Woodhead, West Somerset Railway? To do an earlier version of the route would be less work. No Luton Parkway or Bedford Caudwell for a start and the newer parts of St Pancras could simply be removed from the 3D model that they have. It's not a boring route at all, far more interesting than ECML as there are more gradients and twists and turns. Still what would I know? I only spent 8 years of my life running trains on the real life route which is clearly no comparison to watching a video on YouTube

[tubemad]

It might be a boring ECML style route for some, perhaps I'm the only one looking forward to giving the 319 an good thrashing down the fast on a Semi-fast FCC service, or hammering a VP185 on the main

[37114]

This might be worth getting simply for the fascinating exit from St Pancras via Kentish Town and the Belsize Tunnels. Being the last but one major route into London from the north, the Midland Railway basically had to tunnel under the obstacles rather than go around them.

Call me cynical, but my bet is that this route will end at St Pancras, with only a token representation of the Thameslink route, if that. Would be nice to get to Blackfriars but I doubt it will be covered by the release.

(A shame really, because the older version of St Pancras and the City line to Moorgate would be ideal for scenario creators, and would only require HST / Cl317 / Cl319. A note to anyone thinking about extending the route themselves - please include Moorgate!)

Agreed.

[chrisonline]

Delighted to see this coming, but disappointed it won't extend to Leicester, my stomping ground until I went away to college.

Way beyond my own abilities, but I hope and pray that someone will want to create an extension to the route, ideally for the full Leicester/Nottingham/Derby triangle and on to Sheffield.

Oh, and then better still, a retro version of the whole extended route, back to the 1960's steam/diesel handover days; hmmm . . Peaks, Sulzer Type 2s, Midland Pullman, Black 5's, Moguls, 9Fs, BR Standards . . .

OK, I've pinched myself back to reality. But I reserve the right to dream . . .

[37114]

Delighted to see this coming, but disappointed it won't extend to Leicester, my stomping ground until I went away to college.

Way beyond my own abilities, but I hope and pray that someone will want to create an extension to the route, ideally for the full Leicester/Nottingham/Derby triangle and on to Sheffield.

Oh, and then better still, a retro version of the whole extended route, back to the 1960's steam/diesel handover days; hmmm . . Peaks, Sulzer Type 2s, Midland Pullman, Black 5's, Moguls, 9Fs, BR Standards . . .

OK, I've pinched myself back to reality. But I reserve the right to dream . . .

It would be nice but I can see why they've done it as Bedford is the natural terminating point for the Thameslink services.

[TheJRB]

I feel that Bedford, as pointed out by others, is a disappointing northern end point.

Delighted to see this coming, but disappointed it won't extend to Leicester, my stomping ground until I went away to college.

Leicester would be a better choice for the northern end. It would allow a run of just over an hour on the fast Sheffield services or an hour and a quarter on the Nottingham stoppers.

It would be nice but I can see why they've done it as Bedford is the natural terminating point for the Thameslink services.

That's the thing though. They've chosen to call it the "Midland Main Line" not "Thameslink". A route which pertains to be the MML should go further than Bedford in my opinion, especially when you consider the length of some of the American routes.

[tubemad]

That's the thing though. They've chosen to call it the "Midland Main Line" not "Thameslink". A route which pertains to be the MML should go further than Bedford in my opinion, especially when you consider the length of some of the American routes.

The thing is though it still is the MML but it depends. If the Thameslink section through the City was included then I'd understand, but if it goes to Farringdon and St Pancras only, I'd expect it to be titled MML, because 98% of it is the MML

[spellow3010]

I am trying to put this announcement in perspective and see whether it has anything to really offer me - but struggling.

London to Bedford - set in the modern world leaves me with the same feeling of something like Kings Cross to Hitchin... or Liverpool Street to Witham... The mileage leaves me slightly unimpressed. Why Bedford? Why stop there?

Will there be AI Eurostars or Javelins to furnish the majority of the remaining platforms at St Pancras? Probably not, so for me, seems pointless to represent that ghost town of a historically wonderful train shed. A 1980s rendition of this line would have meant that at least the full train shed would be used, with <shock horror> parcels, commuter trains, HSTs, Class 45s, 31s, 47s etc etc available for scenario creation.

Having lived for 3 years of my life in Luton (mid-1990s) and used the train northbound and southbound (HST, last of the loco-hauled sets and 319s) it isn't a route that screams 'must buy' to me I'm afraid. Kudos to those more enthusiastic however - we all like (and expect) different things. Shunting the aggregates siding at Luton with a 33 might float somebody's boat (is it still there?)

I am going to stick my neck on the line here and predict (yes, a prediction...) how this will work...

I think you will see an EMT livery HST as default stock.
There will be FCC Class 319 scenarios for it.

The premium additional rolling stock will be the Class 222 (Class 220 with EMT skin).
Possibly a Thameslink Class 387 (377 reskin) on Marketplace.

Finally - I predict a lot of 'same old same old quickly bored' angst in this thread or the 'now released thread.'

#shouldhavegonetoleicester

Back to the Riveria line 1980s blue AP scenario pack for me

[benalex]

I am rather gutted that Dovetail has only gone as far as Bedford, However...

If they actually made an effort to make the line run from London Bridge or Blackfriars through St. Pancras Low Level, or even to Moorgate (for pre 2009 scenarios), and somehow allow for chained scenarios from Brighton to Bedford utilising London to Brighton, South London Network, and London to Bedford, the scenario potential would be limitless, and no doubt AP would do wonders for us. A scenario from Brighton to Bedford via Tulse Hill, or diverted through winding commuter lines of London would be awesome, and the future possibility of a Sutton Loop extension (like the Sheerness Branch) would also allow for Luton to Sutton services!

...but then I'm probably dreaming as, like others, knowing DTG, I have a gut feeling this won't be the case, and they'll just recycle St Pancras station from the London to Faversham route for the terminus, the Thameslink route won't be joined together, and it will just be another boring point A to point B, run-of-the-mill commuter route. However, if they do allow it to be connected somehow, and/or include extensions it will make up for the shortness of the route.

[Merlin75]

The reason we're getting short routes like this is because this is what we asked for in a poll DTG did and that we don't want routes of decent length. Well this is the reason DTG give for these short routes.

[trainfan321]

I still wish Jordi would finish his awesome 319, as there is now a real good reason to finish it.

[rfletcher72]

and they'll just recycle St Pancras station from the London to Faversham route for the terminus,

If they already have a suitable asset available, why bother to make another? - I don't see the sense in doing so.

I half expect someone may now point out that x and y is wrong with the KHS depiction of STP, but on the admittedly few occasions I have gone into there in the sim, it looked ok to me,