Crashes

[JustRight]

Hi All,

Well, I have gone to the very considerable trouble of pruning my TS2015 environment. It now contains only the RSC/DTG supplied routes and all associated Assets, plus the Just Trains routes and Assets. This makes the Assets set way smaller.

However, despite this, the scenario I have been trying to run continues to crash at almost exactly the same spot every time. The scenario is "JT 20 - Torness Flasks Part One". At a time index of around 09:45 on the TS2015 clock, just past Prestonpans you pass a pair of parking bays alongside of the motorway. One contains a crane, the other a police car and some other cars. Just beyond this point this scenario fails for me, EVERY time, a crash with the usual dump taken.

I begin to suspect that this may be a fault in the route and/or the scenarios. I have also had the scenario "Class 66 EWS - Dropping the Ballast" fail in a similar way, although at a different location. The memory claimed by Railworks.exe at the time of failure was quite low, less than 2Gb, and the GPU memory used was only about 1.3Gb.

Very frustrating and very disappointing.

[JustRight]

Hi All,

Further to my post above. I have loaded the route into the Route Editor and then used the Compass Gizmo to go to "Prestonpans". I then used the arrow keys to simply 'fly' along the track away from Prestonpans. I passed the motorway pull-offs I described, and just past the second of the parking bays the Editor crashed!!!

So, it would seem that this is a problem with the route itself???

Anyway, when it crashed I was flying along above the track bed, with the shift key pressed, so I was moving quickly. So, I tried again, this time moving slowly. Same result!!! LogMate shows lots of the following errors just prior to the crash:
[RunTimeError 6:57:37 PM] Verify failed:
[RunTimeError 6:57:37 PM] cNetworkRibbon.cpp : 3585
[RunTimeError 6:57:37 PM]
[RunTimeError 6:57:37 PM] Expression: numPoints < 10000
[RunTimeError 6:57:37 PM]
[RunTimeError 6:57:37 PM] Trying to allocate a ridiculous number of vertices!!
[RunTimeError 6:57:37 PM] Verify failed:
[RunTimeError 6:57:37 PM]
[RunTimeError 6:57:37 PM] cNetworkRibbon.cpp : 3585
[RunTimeError 6:57:37 PM]
[RunTimeError 6:57:37 PM] Expression: numPoints < 10000
[RunTimeError 6:57:37 PM]
[RunTimeError 6:57:37 PM] Trying to allocate a ridiculous number of vertices!!

So, I tried again, this time flying along well above the track bed. Once again it crashed.

Very near to where the crash occurs I can see a Black Rectangle outlined around a water pond. This seems to be the object that displays the water. As it stands this Black outline intersects the track itself, so I tried removing the object so that it did not intersect the track. I was then able to fly beyond this point, although there seems to be a big stutter with a tile change over right at that point.

Could this be the issue?

Would one of you that have this route, and can use the Route Editor, try to travel to the same location as I have and try to move along the track away from Prestonpans, almost due East, just past the point where there are two motorway parking bays and a small pond to the right of the track. Can you access and pass this spot successfully? An approximate location is: Lat = 55.96403 Long = -2.92945

Many Thanks,
Trevor

[Janeytrains]

Hi All,

Well, I have gone to the very considerable trouble of pruning my TS2015 environment. It now contains only the RSC/DTG supplied routes and all associated Assets, plus the Just Trains routes and Assets. This makes the Assets set way smaller.

However, despite this, the scenario I have been trying to run continues to crash at almost exactly the same spot every time. The scenario is "JT 20 - Torness Flasks Part One". At a time index of around 09:45 on the TS2015 clock, just past Prestonpans you pass a pair of parking bays alongside of the motorway. One contains a crane, the other a police car and some other cars. Just beyond this point this scenario fails for me, EVERY time, a crash with the usual dump taken.

I begin to suspect that this may be a fault in the route and/or the scenarios. I have also had the scenario "Class 66 EWS - Dropping the Ballast" fail in a similar way, although at a different location. The memory claimed by Railworks.exe at the time of failure was quite low, less than 2Gb, and the GPU memory used was only about 1.3Gb.

Very frustrating and very disappointing.

Trevor, have you tried reinstalling. I ran both of these scenarios a couple of times today to see if I had the problem and all was fine. Both scenarios completed with a tick. I did notice there is an asset load, with trees popping up in the background just past the police car on the motorway, so I wonder if that is failing for you? I wonder if one of your install files is corrupt.

Just a thought as I ran these same scenarios a couple of times today to see if I could help you, but all was well.

Jane

[casrtt]

Hi All,

Well, I have gone to the very considerable trouble of pruning my TS2015 environment. It now contains only the RSC/DTG supplied routes and all associated Assets, plus the Just Trains routes and Assets. This makes the Assets set way smaller.

However, despite this, the scenario I have been trying to run continues to crash at almost exactly the same spot every time. The scenario is "JT 20 - Torness Flasks Part One". At a time index of around 09:45 on the TS2015 clock, just past Prestonpans you pass a pair of parking bays alongside of the motorway. One contains a crane, the other a police car and some other cars. Just beyond this point this scenario fails for me, EVERY time, a crash with the usual dump taken.

I begin to suspect that this may be a fault in the route and/or the scenarios. I have also had the scenario "Class 66 EWS - Dropping the Ballast" fail in a similar way, although at a different location. The memory claimed by Railworks.exe at the time of failure was quite low, less than 2Gb, and the GPU memory used was only about 1.3Gb.

Very frustrating and very disappointing.

Just ran the part one scenario and it runs fine, no trouble at all. The same with dropping the ballast scenario.
At 09:45 the class 166 starts in the flask scenario and does your ballast scenario fail at 23:57, which is the start time for that class 166. If it does would look into your JT SR Class 166.
I am cloning my scenarios and editing them with the correct rolling stock, if I have it.

[JustRight]

Trevor, have you tried reinstalling. I ran both of these scenarios a couple of times today to see if I had the problem and all was fine. Both scenarios completed with a tick. I did notice there is an asset load, with trees popping up in the background just past the police car on the motorway, so I wonder if that is failing for you? I wonder if one of your install files is corrupt.

Just a thought as I ran these same scenarios a couple of times today to see if I could help you, but all was well.

Jane

Just ran the part one scenario and it runs fine, no trouble at all. The same with dropping the ballast scenario.
At 09:45 the class 166 starts in the flask scenario and does your ballast scenario fail at 23:57, which is the start time for that class 166. If it does would look into your JT SR Class 166.
I am cloning my scenarios and editing them with the correct rolling stock, if I have it.

Thanks Jane and casrtt.

At least I know it is something in my setup. Will look deeper, particularly at that Class 166.

Cheers

[JustRight]

Hi All,

Further to my post above. I have loaded the route into the Route Editor and then used the Compass Gizmo to go to "Prestonpans". I then used the arrow keys to simply 'fly' along the track away from Prestonpans. I passed the motorway pull-offs I described, and just past the second of the parking bays the Editor crashed!!!

So, it would seem that this is a problem with the route itself???

Anyway, when it crashed I was flying along above the track bed, with the shift key pressed, so I was moving quickly. So, I tried again, this time moving slowly. Same result!!! LogMate shows lots of the following errors just prior to the crash:
[RunTimeError 6:57:37 PM] Verify failed:
[RunTimeError 6:57:37 PM] cNetworkRibbon.cpp : 3585
[RunTimeError 6:57:37 PM]
[RunTimeError 6:57:37 PM] Expression: numPoints < 10000
[RunTimeError 6:57:37 PM]
[RunTimeError 6:57:37 PM] Trying to allocate a ridiculous number of vertices!!
[RunTimeError 6:57:37 PM] Verify failed:
[RunTimeError 6:57:37 PM]
[RunTimeError 6:57:37 PM] cNetworkRibbon.cpp : 3585
[RunTimeError 6:57:37 PM]
[RunTimeError 6:57:37 PM] Expression: numPoints < 10000
[RunTimeError 6:57:37 PM]
[RunTimeError 6:57:37 PM] Trying to allocate a ridiculous number of vertices!!

So, I tried again, this time flying along well above the track bed. Once again it crashed.

Very near to where the crash occurs I can see a Black Rectangle outlined around a water pond. This seems to be the object that displays the water. As it stands this Black outline intersects the track itself, so I tried removing the object so that it did not intersect the track. I was then able to fly beyond this point, although there seems to be a big stutter with a tile change over right at that point.

Could this be the issue?

Would one of you that have this route, and can use the Route Editor, try to travel to the same location as I have and try to move along the track away from Prestonpans, almost due East, just past the point where there are two motorway parking bays and a small pond to the right of the track. Can you access and pass this spot successfully? An approximate location is: Lat = 55.96403 Long = -2.92945

Many Thanks,
Trevor

So, after a couple of valuable suggestions, which sadly did not help my problem, I have gone so far as to install Newcastle to Edinburgh onto a completely vanilla instance of TS2015. No additional Assets, nothing unusual, just the base version of TS2015 which had been freshly verified, plus the JT Newcastle to Edinburgh route.

I then loaded the route into the Editor and traveled to "Prestonpans" and then flew along the line to the problem area. It turns out to be at the crossover of Tile -000083+000107 to -000082+000107. And once again, even on this vanilla fresh version of TS2015, the program crashes at this very spot!!!

The only thing I can see there is a pond of water that the Tile boundaries actually bisect. So I found the Water blueprint being used "Kuju\RailSimulator\Environment\Water\Water blueprint000.bin". This is the "Water Lake Reflective" object. And I temporarily deleted it!

To my surprise I was then able to load the route into the Editor and happily travel between the offending tiles without TS2015 crashing!!!

So I restored the "Water blueprint000.bin" file and re-loaded the route into the Editor. Once again I traveled to "Prestonpans" and flew along the track to the East. Not far out of Prestonpans is a small Lake or Pond. This Lake is bisected by two Tiles that are not on the line of the track. If I move off of the Track and attempt to cross the Tile boundary across the Lake then once again the program will crash!!!

What on earth could be wrong that would cause the "Water Lake Reflective" object to cause such a problem? As this obviously does not affect everybody, I wonder just what the problem might be? Display drivers perhaps?

Very Confused,
Trevor

[JustRight]

Further to the above.

If I reduce the "Water Quality" slider to it's leftmost position ie: its minimum value, then I can pass across the problem Tile boundaries.

So I increased the "Water Quality" slider up one notch. At this position the water displayed without any form of reflection, and once again I was able to pass across the problem Tile boundaries.

However, increasing the "Water Quality" slider up one more notch caused the water to display with simple reflections, and as soon as I attempted to cross the problem Tile boundary the program would crash!!!

So it has something to do with Water and Reflections???

Very frustrating, no other route I have displays any such problem like this.

[JustRight]

OK, some more info.

I have just installed the route into TS2014.
When looking at these problem areas in the TS2014 Editor it works perfectly. So it would seem that this is something special to TS2015, or perhaps more accurately my instance of TS2015.

Despite performing a verify on my 'base' version of TS2015 this route simply crashes all over the place. Anywhere there seems to be water and a Tile boundary ??????

What on earth is going on. I wonder why this is working for you all and not for me?

Looks like a support call for the JT guys may be in order, although I have tried everything that they are likely to suggest.

[gptech]

I'd be inclined to go along with your thoughts regarding graphics drivers (or the GPU itself) Trevor, particularly as it seems to work when the 'load' is reduced by dropping the water quality setting. What GPU and driver version are you running?

Have you looked at other routes with water? (I expect you have)
Have you tried creating new route and placing the *offending* water asset in it?

[JustRight]

I'd be inclined to go along with your thoughts regarding graphics drivers (or the GPU itself) Trevor, particularly as it seems to work when the 'load' is reduced by dropping the water quality setting. What GPU and driver version are you running?

Have you looked at other routes with water? (I expect you have)
Have you tried creating new route and placing the *offending* water asset in it?

Hi Gary,

Thanks for the suggestions. Unfortunately the Water object is the default Kuju one, so it is used everywhere.

I have tried going back a few levels on my graphics drivers, to no avail,
My graphics card is an nVidia GTX 690 dual GPU 4Gb currently running driver version 347.09 WHQL, which is the latest.

No other route displays this behaviour. It is something unique with Newcastle to Edinburgh on my setup. But it works OK in TS2014. Go figure

Trevor

[Springer6]

I've just run the Scenario " JT20-Clearing the leaves" with the route installed in TS2014. The route looked fine with excellent scenery and weather plus no white hills and initially ran very well. However after the train reversed direction north of Alnmouth and travelled towards the intended stop on the up loop south of Acklington, The points refused to allow the train onto the loop, offering the player train a path onto the up main instead. I tried waiting a while at the green signal for the points to change and divergance indicator to show as I was a few minutes ahead of the scheduled arrival time in the loop. However, the intended southbound passing HST came and ran into the back of my train so "game over".
I haven't tried this scenario in TS2015 yet.

Has anyone else experienced this collision problem with this scenario ? Is it because I was running early ? Or it it because the scenario was being run in TS2014 ?

[JustRight]

Hi All,

Just another word regarding my crashing issues with TS2015.

I have now been able to determine that this problem is NOT isolated to Newcastle to Edinburgh. I have found that I can cause ANY of my routes to fail if I cross from one Tile to another that has Reflective Water defined on it. I have even seen this crash occur now on venerable old routes like the East Coast Mainline (Newcastle to York). This is whilst in the Route Editor so no scenario's involved. If I just fly around in the Route Editor until I find a Tile with some Water on it, as soon as I cross the Tile boundary, CRASH!

This even occurs on a vanilla freshly verified instance of TS2015, without any mods or third party data!!!

So sorry Just Trains, not your fault at all.

Something in TS2015 does not like my system, and I believe that this has only occurred in recent times. TS2014 works perfectly.

Very Frustrating!

[thetrainfan]

Hi All,

Just another word regarding my crashing issues with TS2015.

I have now been able to determine that this problem is NOT isolated to Newcastle to Edinburgh. I have found that I can cause ANY of my routes to fail if I cross from one Tile to another that has Reflective Water defined on it. I have even seen this crash occur now on venerable old routes like the East Coast Mainline (Newcastle to York). This is whilst in the Route Editor so no scenario's involved. If I just fly around in the Route Editor until I find a Tile with some Water on it, as soon as I cross the Tile boundary, CRASH!

This even occurs on a vanilla freshly verified instance of TS2015, without any mods or third party data!!!

So sorry Just Trains, not your fault at all.

Something in TS2015 does not like my system, and I believe that this has only occurred in recent times. TS2014 works perfectly.

Very Frustrating!

So this problem may be able to be averted if using the non-reflective water?

[gypbrc]

Perhaps this is related to the reduced draw distance in 2015. The water decal is attempting to pass the terrain tiles that haven't been drawn yet. This would be especially problematic at tile boundaries. The issue is not replicated with the non-reflective type because the decal does not make a pass of the surrounding terrain and the draw distance in 2014 was higher so it wasn't an issue.

Possibility?

[gptech]

Trevor,
how sure are you that the pond in question actually spans the tile boundary? Is it possible you're seeing the terrain grid rather than the actual tile boundaries?
Could somebody else fire up the route in the editor and see whether Trevor has a pond that's 'moved'?