Graphics & Rendering Issue

[RCH37401]

Hi all

I have just gone on to WCML North and continued adding trains to a free roam I have been creating. This has become a challenge as I am normally hit with SBHH errors due to the computer being slow, as explained below.

My graphics card is a nVidia 9800 GT which, since the TS2012 update, has lost quality and I now run it with the second to lowest graphics setting on the slider within the settings on the RailWorks openning screen. I also have 4Gb RAM with Pentium(R) Dual-Core E5300 processor at 2.60GHz.

As normal, the route took about 5 minutes to load and it rendered a few bits as the editing screen came on.

I gave it a minute or two and began to move around the world editor, but when I moved off a tile near Kingmoor depot at Carlisle, the (attached) image below appeared. I went back to Kingmoor and it disappeared back to the normal view. I used the '9' map and clicked to go to Carlisle station next. I exited the map and it looked the same, but this time it began to go much slower than normal. This was occuring whilst the editor was rendering assets, as it normally does due to being slow on this route. The whole screen/monitor went blank, then came back on using Windows 7 Basic (I run Windows 7 64-bit). It then went blank again, and when it came back on after a few seconds, RailWorks' screen was blank. It then threw the SBHH error and the program stopped responding. I then used task manager to shut down RailWorks.

Do any of you know what may have gone wrong here? My first thought was the graphics card - the 9800 GT is fairly old now and I have been looking to replace it, but I haven't had time to use RailWorks as much for pleasure so it hasn't been a priority.

Any help with what may be causing this would be appreciated. I may look towards getting 6Gb or 8Gb RAM soon anyway, but if I needed a new graphics card, I can give the whole computer an update with graphics and installed memory.

Many thanks in advance

Richard

[rivimey]

Hi,

I get a less-severe form of this sort of problem if I use fullscreen view and return to the desktop; it seems to me that some of the graphic elements on the screen get corrupted or replaced by other things, and the sim doesn't repair them on resume.

Sometimes I have been able to restore normal view by Jumping somewhere many tiles away from the problem area, then Jumping back; the point being to get RW to recreate the graphics from scratch rather than relying on already-loaded elements.

In your context, I would wonder whether your gpu has enough onboard ram, and whether you could reduce load on what ram it has - eg by using Windows' Classic mode not Aero.

Just thoughts... I don't know of a fix.

Regards
Ruth

[gptech]

Could well be a bit of over heating there, can you replicate this problem at will or has it just been a one-off?

[RCH37401]

Hi Ruth - It changed to windows basic rather than aero part the way through the episode.

GP - I will attempt to replicate it by doing exactly what I did last time, Ie. same route, same movement, etc.. Oddly, I had only just started Railworks and I believe the GPU temperature didn't rise above 60'C. I have had temperatures of around 68'C when playing before with no real problems. I have become used to Railworks being slow whilst on routes like Wales & Borders (of which I haven't used since the update), and since the update of TS2012 WCML North.

I'll let you know if I have the problem again, it may be that I should just upgrade the RAM (as Ruth suggested) and add a new graphics card (12Gb RAM and a nVidia GTX 560?)

Many thanks

[gptech]

Upgrading the graphics card and RAM is a good idea, but 12GB is a wee bit OTT. 4GB is enough, 8GB is a nice luxury and still affordable, anything over that is not going to help you. Of course your motherboard might not even support that amount!
The 560 is a great card, but given the CPU you have it won't be able to perform to it's capabilities, and with prices starting at around £140 for the 336 core 560, rising to over £230 for a 448 core 560Ti you want to be sure you're getting your moneys worth.
£110 at Scan would get you an EVGA 460, and would be a better companion for your CPU.

Of course ignore that if you're planning on buying a GPU now and upping the CPU/MB in a few months (though I'd say that's a back to front way of going about it) as then a 560 would fit the bill.

[RCH37401]

Thanks for that information, GP.

What CPU and Motherboard would allow the GTX 560 (or 560 Ti) and 8GB RAM to work at its best?

Many thanks in advance mate.

Cheers

[gptech]

I'm biased, so can only recommend a Sandybridge set up with preferably an i5 (-2500k variant if it fits in the budget) and a socket 1155 motherboard. Which motherboard and which chip set depends mainly on your budget, and which features you deem essential/important/affordable.

[peterfhayes]

I agree with gptech re the choice of an i5 SB as an upgrade.
The OP was talking about upgrading to 12GB of RAM - I run an E8600 and I have had great difficulty in finding anything larger than 2GB DDR2 RAM sticks at a reasonable price, so the max you could get on that rig (without going bankrupt) is probably 8GB (4 x 2GB) but 8GB is only useful if you are running a 64-bit OS.

One thing to try is to see if there is a dust build up on the card and to see if it is seated correctly - cards can move in the slots over time. If you are comfortable with computers or know someone who is cleaning the contacts can help if done properly.

You will enjoy a SB i5 2500K!
Regards
PeterH

[RCH37401]

Thanks GP and Peter. I will look further into those soon, as I don't think my E5300 processor may be coping well with Railworks since the upgrade.

I have just tried to replicated what happened in the first post, and here are my findings:

I started Railworks with the GPU at 43'C. It took a while to reach the openning menu screen so I could choose a route/train, but it got there after a minute or two.

I selected to edit my free roam scenario, and once again it took over 5 minutes to load the route.

When it had finally come off the loading screen, the track was just beginning to render in the world editor and the fps rate was very low (as per usual on the WCML N).

I moved south and off the tile I was on at Kingmoor. After a short while, the screen went from being the image in the attached screenshot 1 to the one in the second (screenshot 2). After moving another few metres within the world editor, it went to what you can see in screenshot 3.

This time it didn't crash, but I shut it down anyway. It was running at 53'C at this point.

The screen also went black briefly as I openned the snip tool to take the screenshot.

Hopefully that can help identify what is happening.

I will open the computer up later and see what condition the inside is in, but I don't think that there will be much dust buildup.

Hopefully this can help you GP.

Thanks,

[rivimey]

Hi Richard,

I would guess that RW is failing to load textures into the graphics card. I doubt it's the main processor itself; that might cause things to slow down, but not misbehave in this way.

My first thought would be to try replacing the graphics card with a borrowed one, if you can, to see whether that fixes things. If it does, I'd diagnose a failed GPU. There are two reasons for this: failed hardware - replace it - or failed software - it might help to delete all video software so as to return to plain-vga, and then reinstall the appropriate nVidia driver.

If not, it's possible there is a more generic problem with the system, but it is very unclear to me at least what that might be. I wouldn't immediately assume the whole PC is broken, though obviously the CPU is not the fastest thing available these days and it might well be appropriate replace it.

Regards
Ruth

[gptech]

I agree with Ruth there Richard, even though reported temps for the GPU are within it's design limits it's possible that the card has been slowly failing and now can't take the higher temps that it did when new---old age, happens to us all.....

I had a 6800GT that went like that, anything over 60 degrees and it just threw artifacts all over the screen.

Could you try loading up a much less demanding route, or even a less demanding portion of WCML, and see what happens?
Picking up on Peter's post, it may be worthwhile taking the graphics card out and giving the fan a good clean, and making sure there's no horrible build up of gunge on the contact strip portion. Chip creep happens, and a card doesn't have to move far in the slot to start throwing up some very odd results.

[RCH37401]

Thanks for the response, Ruth. It would seem that it is the case, because as I have explained below, it is taking a while for rendering to complete.

I have just tried the Oxford - Paddington route, GP. I loaded one of the default free roams at Oxford and it worked fine. I entered world editor, and although the linear assets and objects took a few minutes to load, it didn't throw anything like the WCML N did. I then went to Paddington, and it certainly took about a minute for all the assets to render. But still no oddities like I have previously posted.

It would suggest, perhaps, that if the graphics card is on its way out, then the more demanding routes are beginning to stop working first, until I'm likely to be left only about to play on the Hedborough North and Templecombe route? Seems like that is the most logical way for the graphics card to end its life!

I am going to have a look within the computer later this evening, clean out any cack that is found around the fan/graphics card, make sure the card is correctly in the slot with nothing obstructing it and then try again on the WCML N to see if anything like earlier happens. Beginning to feel that there may be a computer upgrade involving the processor, RAM and graphics card on the way! I guess that it is required because the computer is two years old this month.

Thanks again guys.

[gptech]

happy Birthday to the computer!!!

[RCH37401]

Hi all

Sorry for the late reply within this thread.

I have just openned the computer case and cleared the dust around the fans and graphics card. There was plenty of cack build up around the graphics card but I have cleared all of this. I also made sure all the connections were fine on the graphics card and that it hadn't slipped out of its slot.

I then went back onto Railworks after I had switched it back on, selected WCML North, same scenario to edit, same moves etc, and it has done exactly the same as before.

I closed Railworks and then lowered the slider to the lowest setting in order to see if dropping the quality of the graphics to minimum would help. This didn't work and I had the same problem.

I assume that it must be the card rather than the buildup of dust (which admittedly there was quite a bit of).

Many thanks for the helps guys, if there is anything else you can recommend I would appreciate it.

Cheers

[gptech]

Any possibility of following Ruths advice and borrowing a graphics card to test with?