RW3 AI / scenario / timetabling issues.

[jivebunny]

Hi All,

Placed in General Discussion as it seems to be a RW3 bug rather than my own cack-handedness

I think I've come across a major timetabling issue in RW3, whereby the dispatched is completely ignoring the service start time. It would explain why none of the scenarios I've created so far in RW3 actually work as expected... The screenshot below comes from a scenario with a start time of 07:00, in which I have a service set to depart Old Oak Common at 07:10 heading for Paddington (set up as a player service here, but the same occurs if it's set up as an AI train). As you can see, the timetable has been calculated as if the train was to depart OOC at 07:00, the second the scenario starts. When I launch the scenario, the service does indeed depart immediately and subsequently makes a total pig's ear of all the other services, which for the most part either end up stopping at a green signal or crawling along at 0.1mph until I exit the scenario.

It seems to be happening on any route I create a scenario on, and it's not something I ever saw in RW2. If a few people could set up something similar and confirm they see the same outcome then I'll get a bug report off to RSC. As it stands this puts a total stop on any scenario creation



JB

[Darpor]

I must admit, I have now tried 9 or 10 scenarios since yesterday and have not had that issue.

[FoggyMorning]

That behaviour occurred in RW2 for player services also; i.e. the dispatcher would always assume the players start time to be the same as the scenario start time regardless of what the actual time entered was. I haven't personally encountered it with AI services though, either pre- or post- update

Steve

[pjt1974]

I've had an issue with an Ai train starting the same time as the player train just stopping at a clear signal thus stopping the player train leaving a siding.
I know this worked in RW2 as it was tested by three members of this forum before 22nd Spetember.
I've tried everything to get the Ai train to pass and clear the lines but to no avail. I even tried starting the Ai train past the exit of the sidings and it wouldn't budge. I've checked the routing of all other services but they are all on the down line when the Ai is pathed along the up line.

[crazyfrogbro]

ai is now dumber than in rw2. I've made a scenario to test if the dispatcher is improved, but it isn't. It's still can't solve the simplest traffic situation what happens every day on a busy mainline. Moreover the crawling ai has come back from it's holidays

The problem is still the same. The dispatcher still don't take into account the time and the position of the trains, it's still not realtime... So it's still impossible to make scenarios with multiple crossings waitings, overtakes on a double track line, etc.

[AndyM77]

That behaviour occurred in RW2 for player services also; i.e. the dispatcher would always assume the players start time to be the same as the scenario start time regardless of what the actual time entered was. I haven't personally encountered it with AI services though, either pre- or post- update

Steve

The (sort of) workaround for this is to create a "Timetabled" rather than Standard scenario type, and you'll start off without the HUD, nor a train to drive. The only drawback here is that inexperienced players can be left wondering what has gone wrong or what train are they supposed to click on to actually start the scenario.

In regards to the opening post.. I haven't started a scenario from scratch in TS2012 yet, but editing my challenge scenario showed no such problems apart from a couple of "Static Consist Conficts" and the times were slightly different to the RW2 version as the physics have been tweaked causing some performance differences for some stock.

I'm going to be playing around with the route editor now I've sorted the above, so if I see anything 'odd' I'll post again.

[transadelaide]

That behaviour occurred in RW2 for player services also; i.e. the dispatcher would always assume the players start time to be the same as the scenario start time regardless of what the actual time entered was. I haven't personally encountered it with AI services though, either pre- or post- update

Steve

The (sort of) workaround for this is to create a "Timetabled" rather than Standard scenario type, and you'll start off without the HUD, nor a train to drive. The only drawback here is that inexperienced players can be left wondering what has gone wrong or what train are they supposed to click on to actually start the scenario.

You can also work around the problem of the player service starting with the scenario by making the first instruction a "stop at" or "pick up passengers" located at the starting position, with the duration set appropriately to add the required delay.

I would consider this better than using a timetable scenario with no player service selected, because it makes things a little clearer that this is your train and you are to stay here until I say so. Staaaaaay. Good doggie.

[Kromaatikse]

The (sort of) workaround for this is to create a "Timetabled" rather than Standard scenario type, and you'll start off without the HUD, nor a train to drive.

Why would making a Timetabled scenario cause that? It only happens if no train has been selected as the Player train.

[crazyfrogbro]

I've tested the performance on testtrak. First when i load the scenario i start at the buildings where a long train stands. I get in, and there i got 35 fps with tsx. Above 10 mph i got 25 fps. Then suddenly 14 fps. Sometimes it rises back to 25 without any camera movement, and then bakc to 14. But if i change the active window (i play in windowed mode) to other, then i get back to railworks window always rises to 25 fps.. then it falls to 14 fps. The funny is, at NEC i have 30 fps (just i cant play because the wagons spontaneous decoupling, and the spontaneous AI derailment (when my train get derailed)).

[larch]

I recently finished a scenario for Bristol to Exeter in RW2, also successfully tested by some forum volunteers. TS12 came along, so I thought I'd re-test it in that before uploading to UKTS. It worked OK as soon as I'd worked out the correct display settings (I used the brilliant new advice from Kromat... in the FAQs), but if I try to edit anything at all most of the AI suddenly won't work, and a large number of 'static consist conflicts' have popped up out of absolutely nowhere (all the relevant loose consists are in sidings well away from any player service or AI activity).

Just to see what would happen I re-drafted the scenario from scratch in TS12 and most of the AI just sits there frozen, with clear paths on the correct side of a main line and no indications of why. It was easy to write successful scenarios in RW2, but I'm feeling frustrated and stuck with TS12. I feel sure that there must be a bug in there somewhere.

To be honest I haven't tried to write a scenario in anything other than B&E (my local and favourite route - I like to recreate my acual journeys as closely as possible) so I guess the route may have specific and individual problems?

I'll have another go this weekend.

Simon Spoerer

[Kromaatikse]

I've noticed that the scenario editor isn't very robust any more too, and I've reported at least one of the most obvious problems I encountered with it. I've since encountered more, but I consider other problems more important than scenario editing for the time being.

As a workaround, I suggest digging out your backup copy of RW2 and using that for editing for now. You do have a backup... right?

[larch]

I do!

[nips_uk]

When TS2012 came out, i completely re-built my route from sratch (many reasons why!) and everything was fine until i tried to do the 2nd scenerio. The first one, no problems. The one AI train does exactly what its supposed to.

However on the 2nd scenerio (which is just a reverse trip of the 1st scenerio) i wanted to add a 2nd AI train that would leave the station from the station where the player starts just before the player train leaves. The AI train leaves, and then suddenly drops to about 0.1mph.

At first i thought it was a track problem, but player train can run over no problem. I then changed the leaving time of the AI train and found that the AI train always drops to 0.1mph after 20sec after the scenerio starts. The other AI train, no problems at all (admittedly this starts at the other end of the line) With the problem train, ive tried starting different platforms, different consist lenghts and totally different trains and all with the same outcome.

Any ideas? its kinda annoying because without it, the station looks a bit bare!

[malkymackay]

Are you trying the scenario directly from the editor with the Play button? I have found the same issues with scenarios I have been working on. I find that it is best to exit to the main menu & start the scenario from there. It was the best way in RW2 as well, to allow the signals to be initialised correctly.

[jivebunny]

Yep, it would seem the "Play" button is broken and the scenarios work fine if launched from the main menu. I sent a bug report off to RSC a few minutes ago to make sure they were aware of it, not sure if anyone else had reported it to them. Very annoying having to exit the editor and re-launch the scenario from the main menu (and I'm lucky, my PC tends to load routes fairly quickly...). Also reported the fact that train priorities seem to be ignored by the dispatcher, with high priority trains having their routes blocked by lower-priority ones. Current pet hate is signals displaying red when they're actually green... Maybe one day we'll have a dispatcher that works