NWC (175+221) AP Sound Patch

[chrisonline]

I will await an official patch from AP

Why wait? It is not actual AP sound files, just edits to the files to link to the AP sounds (which you will already have in the AP folders), mirroring exactly how it was previously done by AP, for DTG's SWC 175, and Cross Country 220. And just as I would have done if I had gottten around to it, and as I have done on several other DLCs at times, where AP haven't yet issued an edit.

No reason not to run with it, because it is exactly how AP will do it as and when, if and when, they get around to it

Because like I said I am not signing up to AT website to get a freeware pack as that gives him another member on his statistics.
Charging people a fee for locked in payware is not on and I won’t support a website that is doing that be it to get access to freeware or. It.

It is a free download, nothing to do with the subscription. You have to register - just like most other community sites you download from, e.g. railsim.de, RWA - but a lot of freeware is freely available including this one.

[rosschris10]

I'm no fanboy of Alan Thomson, but by Jove he's done a good job with his website. I've paid me 30 quid and I'm as happy as Larry. This week I've had more fun out of TS than I've had for years because of it - loads of good scenarios and content, got me 30 quids worth already. Glad I've not had to resort to spitting bile and venom this week instead. Driving trains is much more fun. I've had to forego my evening pint of scotch to cover the costs, but hey, it's saving me liver too. Win win situation.

Lovely bit of advertising you have done there to TRY and get people intersted in the website. FYI 99 percent of the content on AT website is freely available on other websites such as UKTS. So for someone who has had an account for ove r1 year here and 17 posts you clearly have not been interested in TS for a long time if you have missed all the content you claim is so amazing over there which is freely available over websites such as this.

Like i said LOVLEY BIT OF ADVERTISING you have done

[bri2808]

I'm no fanboy of Alan Thomson, but by Jove he's done a good job with his website. I've paid me 30 quid and I'm as happy as Larry. This week I've had more fun out of TS than I've had for years because of it - loads of good scenarios and content, got me 30 quids worth already. Glad I've not had to resort to spitting bile and venom this week instead. Driving trains is much more fun. I've had to forego my evening pint of scotch to cover the costs, but hey, it's saving me liver too. Win win situation.

Lovely bit of advertising you have done there to TRY and get people intersted in the website. FYI 99 percent of the content on AT website is freely available on other websites such as UKTS. So for someone who has had an account for ove r1 year here and 17 posts you clearly have not been interested in TS for a long time if you have missed all the content you claim is so amazing over there which is freely available over websites such as this.

Like i said LOVLEY BIT OF ADVERTISING you have done

So because he has not posted much on here, and only been registered for a year (on this forum - Could still have been downloading via UKTS) it gives you the authority to decide how interested in TS he is?? I have hardly posted for a year either does that mean that I am not interested either? I liken you to people on football websites that say that if you don't go to every single game you are not a true fan. Both opinions are a load of tripe but because I like the freedom to be able to post on this forum as and when I like (something I believe not everyone has had in the past eh ) I will refrain from what I really think about this post and your recent ones.

He is not advertising he is just commenting that he likes the content thats all. Its because of personal attacks such as this that most people have stopped posting on here with their opinions.

[wild5551]

Personally I find that the amount that ATS and UKTS fanboys are ripping themselves apart on the Internet absolutely hilarious. Others way wish to join in and bring some popcorn.

[AndiS]

DTG will enjoy the break they get, if they ever cared about the anti-DTG posts here as much as some would hope.

I don't say that there is no doubt left about some freeware being currently distributed behind his paywall alone. This one is a thorny question.

But I also saw that he promises to distribute 80% of the first month's subscription among creators or whoever. That means that the money hunt gets even more complex when much of the money is not left with him.

This reminds me of the days when there were community CDs sold by UKTS (and also given away for free to advertise MSTS and the community) and it transpired that some significant creators received free premium membership on UKTS - ah, those evil payware creators in freeware disguise.

Also the case of how much beer makes it payware was discussed at length many years ago. UKTS is easier because it is almost impossible to get out of a pub before you pay more than UKTS takes for a month. And it is not much fun to go to the pub only once. And the hours of enjoyment from train simming are rather more.

Now with the 30 in one go, that is more than I spend per night, but much less then in a year.

But joking aside, time and time again this discussion crops up. Downloading stuff on the net incurs cost at the provider. Compare the threat to kill pictures on the site here. There is a wide field of small site that live on donations. And there are some others that try other schemes. There is much to hate and much to love. The good thing about it is that no one enforces anything.

In the case of this sound pack, you could say that he beats UKTS if he offers faster free download under the otherwise same terms - that you register. That does not make me a fan boy, unless fan boy is the new name for all the 90% of the world that do not share your personal opinion.

[jpvdveer]

FYI 99 percent of the content on AT website is freely available on other websites such as UKTS.

Not sure this is an entirely correct reflection. UKTS surely has a great historic archive, but in terms of the newer freeware content, very little can actually be found on UKTS. This is of course in large part due to the fact that all TrainSimDesigns content is now on Alan's site (the Railways of Devon & Cornwall, the Atlantic Coast line, the great Virgin/LNER IC125 / 225 packs (the former already with more than 1,000 downloads), etc. etc. But also apart from this, more new patches/fixes etc. appears to have been released on ATS than on UKTS in recent weeks.

Also: 99 per cent of the content on AT website is freely available on the AT website. The ECML Merge and WCML 5.1 are currently the only exceptions to that rule.

I have often used UKTS in the past and have been a paid member. But UKTS is just not user-friendly either for paying or non-paying members, with poor search facilities in particular (try finding a scenario for a particular route), and probably the oldest site by far out of the 100s I use on a regular basis. A new version of UKTS is being developed (http://wwwnew.uktrainsim.com/) but I think I already saw that for the first time some two years ago or something like that. With such a slow pace of development, it should not come as a surprise that others step in and do a better job. To the extent the slow development of the new UKTS site is due to financial constraints, this just goes to show that UKTS does not have a good business model. With both users and publishers now moving to ATS in seemingly large numbers, I would not be surprised if one day, UKTS will need to ask for donations in order at least keep the historical archive in the air.

[sandy130674]

Lovely bit of advertising you have done there to TRY and get people intersted in the website. FYI 99 percent of the content on AT website is freely available on other websites such as UKTS. So for someone who has had an account for ove r1 year here and 17 posts you clearly have not been interested in TS for a long time if you have missed all the content you claim is so amazing over there which is freely available over websites such as this.

Like i said LOVLEY BIT OF ADVERTISING you have done

I'm not advertising, I'm just giving my opinion, very much like you have done. The website is a much needed boost for TS after the loss of TSD. As for you judging my interest in TS by the number of posts I've written - well that makes me chuckle. I wish I had more time to complain about how awful everything was on TS, but you know what, life is much nicer if you keep your head down and spend some quality time on TS rather than post unnecessary stuff on forums. I brew beer for a living, have a girlfriend, I ride my bike and play the piano, and at all other times I drive trains. 17 posts on UKTS is testament to that. Life's too short to moan about everything!

[gptech]

Life's too short to moan about everything!

You're not from Yorkshire then?

[alanch]

Life's too short to moan about everything!

You're not from Yorkshire then?

But we are Gary, so we know the truth!

[gptech]

But we are Gary, so we know the truth!

which is why we moan about it Alan

OK...to be (or attempt to be) more on topic, like any download from any source this has brought an issue for a user. Stuff happens.
The download is described as:

An AP Sound patch

so it's quite easy to read that as describing an AP produced 'patch', a misunderstanding subsequently openly acknowledged by rosschris. Whether you agree with his stance or not, whether it's right or not, you/we/they/nobody can argue that he isn't sticking to the principles he's set---he refuses to support a site that is more or less proven to be in a grey area with regard to what is or isn't freeware, or what is a legal. or possibly more importantly, what is a moral means of distributing it. Disregard any angst in any posts from one side or the other and consider that.

[Easilyconfused]

A new version of UKTS is being developed (http://wwwnew.uktrainsim.com/) but I think I already saw that for the first time some two years ago or something like that. With such a slow pace of development, it should not come as a surprise that others step in and do a better job. To the extent the slow development of the new UKTS site is due to financial constraints, this just goes to show that UKTS does not have a good business model. With both users and publishers now moving to ATS in seemingly large numbers, I would not be surprised if one day, UKTS will need to ask for donations in order at least keep the historical archive in the air.

Not quite sure where you are getting some of these "facts" from but I would suggest you check them first.

Yes, the face-lifted site has been a long time coming. I understand there is a plan to move the hosting shortly which is where the uncertainty over the album has come from. The switch to HTTPS was part of the master plan (which I have not seen in its entirety).

It is not a lack of money that has been holding it back. The Site Owner has a demanding day job as many people know.

The business model works to a point and is unlikely to change. Your opinion of it is simply that an opinion. You seem very keen to talk up the demise of UKTS without much evidence to back it up. New content only appears when it is uploaded and where authors upload to is their prerogative.

During several discussions with the Site Owner and Site Admin it has always been clear to me - if the site becomes unviable then the shutters will come down.

[jpvdveer]

Many thanks for this clarification - well noted. Let us all see what the future will bring. I am not keen to talk up the demise of UKTS - I am keen for UKTS and its vast file archive to continue to be available for the benefit of us all. But UKTS does need to improve for this to be the case and must be mindful of the clear risks that ATS' (apparent) success now poses. In particular, as things stand, with most new uploads now going to ATS, a premium membership at UKTS will become less and less attractive, perhaps one day putting its financial viability at risk unless other funding sources exist.

Just to illustrate: there has been one new upload to UKTS today and one yesterday (as well as one on each of the two days before). Today alone, as a new feature on ATS shows, there have been 10 new uploads to ATS.

You are right in highlighting that fact that I do not have evidence to back up my suggestions (other than the facts reported above). But I am speaking as a competition economist with a lot of experience in other "platform" markets characterised by similar features (interdependency between users and developers on a platform). Myspace, an old social networking site that once had a leading position, was slow in developing its site and was subsequently marginalised by Facebook with a superior business model which managed to attract both users and advertisers - the market "tilted" towards Facebook in a dramatic way. The present situation bears similarities - it is ATS that seems to be attracting both many users and many developers (and has carefully crafted its business model in order to achieve this). This poses risks to the long-term future of UKTS.

I am not sure to what extent the Site Owner quite realises the magnitude of the threat that ATS poses already now, just weeks after its launch, to the future of UKTS. If not, he probably should be made aware sooner rather than later.

Look forward to the new site going live, hopefully very soon.

[gptech]

there has been one new upload to UKTS today and one yesterday (as well as one on each of the two days before). Today alone, as a new feature on ATS shows, there have been 10 new uploads to ATS.

How many of those 10 have been existing packages just waiting for a home?

I am not sure to what extent the Site Owner quite realises the magnitude of the threat that ATS poses already now,

There's a very simple algorithm to explain that.... fa²

(clarifications of the variables f and a available by pm)

[jpvdveer]

How many of those 10 have been existing packages just waiting for a home?

Good question which of course cannot be answered. A full assessment will need to be based over a longer timeframe, when this valid comment will become less likely to be an issue. In any event, none of these packages have chosen UKTS as their home.

There's a very simple algorithm to explain that.... fa²

Not sure I'm following you here - apologies for my ignorance!

[gptech]

Today alone, as a new feature on ATS shows, there have been 10 new uploads to ATS.

How many have been from folk previously using UKTS as the distribution system?