Jolly Good Fun ... Narrow Gauge rails in North Wales

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xguerra
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Re: Jolly Good Fun ... Narrow Gauge rails in North Wales

Post by xguerra »

thephantomphish wrote:Experimenting with a RWTools clone of the route, I did successfully manage to swap the track for the Corris track, which looks very smart, but according to RWTools all the PP narrow gauge tracks .bin files still seem to be required and I cannot swap them or uninstall them. Where should I be looking to remove this - routeproperties.xml? tracks.bin?
I also annoyingly cannot remove the PP Tram Track rule (originally used for the standard gauge lines). Despite swapping it out for various others it still shows as a requirement when I check the route with RWTools. I'm obviously missing something out of these processes - but any ideas what?!
Normal swapping of assets doesn't work on the track.

You need to open the tracks.bin file in the network folder and manually swap the directory references for the track and track rule.

For example you'd need to swap:

Code: Select all

											<BlueprintID>
												<iBlueprintLibrary-cAbsoluteBlueprintID>
													<BlueprintSetID>
														<iBlueprintLibrary-cBlueprintSetID>
															<Provider d:type="cDeltaString">Community</Provider>
															<Product d:type="cDeltaString">ProjectPlatform</Product>
														</iBlueprintLibrary-cBlueprintSetID>
													</BlueprintSetID>
													<BlueprintID d:type="cDeltaString">RailNetwork\track\2&apos;3&apos;&apos;_bh_Track.xml</BlueprintID>
												</iBlueprintLibrary-cAbsoluteBlueprintID>
											</BlueprintID>
with

Code: Select all

											<BlueprintID>
												<iBlueprintLibrary-cAbsoluteBlueprintID>
													<BlueprintSetID>
														<iBlueprintLibrary-cBlueprintSetID>
															<Provider d:type="cDeltaString">SHG</Provider>
															<Product d:type="cDeltaString">NarrowGaugePack01</Product>
														</iBlueprintLibrary-cBlueprintSetID>
													</BlueprintSetID>
													<BlueprintID d:type="cDeltaString">RailNetwork\track\2&apos;3&apos;&apos;_bh_Track.xml</BlueprintID>
												</iBlueprintLibrary-cAbsoluteBlueprintID>
											</BlueprintID>
For the track. And:

Code: Select all

															<BlueprintSetID>
																<iBlueprintLibrary-cBlueprintSetID>
																	<Provider d:type="cDeltaString">Community</Provider>
																	<Product d:type="cDeltaString">ProjectPlatform</Product>
																</iBlueprintLibrary-cBlueprintSetID>
															</BlueprintSetID>
															<BlueprintID d:type="cDeltaString">RailNetwork\TrackRules\PP_Tram_Trackrule.xml</BlueprintID>
														</iBlueprintLibrary-cAbsoluteBlueprintID>
With

Code: Select all

															<BlueprintSetID>
																<iBlueprintLibrary-cBlueprintSetID>
																	<Provider d:type="cDeltaString">SHG</Provider>
																	<Product d:type="cDeltaString">NarrowGaugePack01</Product>
																</iBlueprintLibrary-cBlueprintSetID>
															</BlueprintSetID>
															<BlueprintID d:type="cDeltaString">RailNetwork\TrackRules\Corris_Track_Rule.xml</BlueprintID>
														</iBlueprintLibrary-cAbsoluteBlueprintID>
For the track rule. Search & Replace should do it all if you copy the sections in exactly as they are, including spaces.
thephantomphish wrote:Regarding ground texture sets - it looks like the Falmouth branch uses the same sets as PP according to the list in the world editor, although I have noticed that some of the files in the folder structure have slightly different names. I have searched various fora and can't seem to find any clue as to what to try to edit and how to do it to swap this stuff out - although a lot of people do say that it is possible but a bit of a pain and sometimes doesn't look right once it has worked. I can't even seem to start to get it swapped! Again, any advice appreciated to at least get me moving with this (after all, it's a fairly important PP requirement to need to remove).
Changing terrain textures is easy. You open the RouteProperties.xml file and change:

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	<TerrainBlueprint>
		<iBlueprintLibrary-cAbsoluteBlueprintID>
			<BlueprintSetID>
				<iBlueprintLibrary-cBlueprintSetID>
					<Provider d:type="cDeltaString">Community</Provider>
					<Product d:type="cDeltaString">ProjectPlatform</Product>
				</iBlueprintLibrary-cBlueprintSetID>
			</BlueprintSetID>
			<BlueprintID d:type="cDeltaString">Environment\Terrain\Texturing.xml</BlueprintID>
		</iBlueprintLibrary-cAbsoluteBlueprintID>
	</TerrainBlueprint>
to

Code: Select all

	<TerrainBlueprint>
		<iBlueprintLibrary-cAbsoluteBlueprintID>
			<BlueprintSetID>
				<iBlueprintLibrary-cBlueprintSetID>
					<Provider d:type="cDeltaString">SHG</Provider>
					<Product d:type="cDeltaString">NarrowGaugePack01</Product>
				</iBlueprintLibrary-cBlueprintSetID>
			</BlueprintSetID>
			<BlueprintID d:type="cDeltaString">Environment\Terrain\Texturing.xml</BlueprintID>
		</iBlueprintLibrary-cAbsoluteBlueprintID>
	</TerrainBlueprint>
The same will have to be done for Route template, skies and weather.
thephantomphish wrote:And finally - I need to do something to change things so that when from the main build menu you choose 'create new scenario' you can then choose between FfR&WHR locations rather than the PP locations. I know this is done by adding .csv markers with Lat and Long etc, but I suspect this needs to be done within some sort of new route file which will then need to be referenced rather than the old PP file. Once again, I'm trying to learn to make fire in a dark room and progress is slow - any advice or pointers towards useful tutorials? I tried to add some markers to the cloned test route and they didn't show up at all.
For this you will need to create a stations.dscv file in an assets directory of your choice but they must be in a folder with the structure Assets/Provider/Product/RouteMarkers.

Inside that file will be a list of the stations with their longitude and latitude. I suggest copying an existing one and modifying it.
Alternatively, I can create one for you.

The same goes for anything I have said here. If you'd like some help, don't hesitate to ask. (Though I would need the latest version of the route to be able to swap anything out :lol: )
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Re: Jolly Good Fun ... Narrow Gauge rails in North Wales

Post by bailey7802 »

Sounds interesting......
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Re: Jolly Good Fun ... Narrow Gauge rails in North Wales

Post by thephantomphish »

Fantastic post, XG, many thanks for that info - I've been looking in the right places so far, at least! Online guidance is spread across many discussion threads, some of which are quite old now, so having a concise list of what to fiddle with will make the job so much easier!

Funny you should mention the updated route, after I posted I went for a spin with the DLG from Caernarfon, just for fun and photography, and it struck me that I've not wrapped up the current still-PP-dependent route for testing by anyone... A bit of an oversight! So keep an eye on your inbox later tonight (probably in the small hours after my late shift this evening!). I've just had a PM from Steve about progress with the Taliesin too, so everything is coming together quite nicely by the sounds of things...

Meanwhile, a few screenshots from the Caernarfon to Dinas section, to whet the appetites of those who want to see a little more of how the top end of the line looks...

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/ ... =928575367

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/ ... =928576029

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/ ... =928576293

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/ ... =928576941

Thanks again to all reading for the continued interest in this project... More news should be following as quickly as these final issues can be dealt with!


ThePhantomPhish
~ Digital model railway engineer responsible for the North Wales Narrow Gauge Railways route ~
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Re: Jolly Good Fun ... Narrow Gauge rails in North Wales

Post by thephantomphish »

Hi all,

I have fantastic news regarding latest progress! Guided by the helpful advice above, I was glad to see I was looking in all the right areas, and had already started to make some of the required changes. The result of my recent endeavours* is as simple as this:

We now have a route that only depends on commercially available assets!!**

There is still a fair amount of payware required - but the route is now built so that someone brand new to TS2017 could, if they wanted to, buy all the required DLC then load it up and run it without anything missing***.

I haven't yet re-started my attempt from months ago to create the .dcsv file required for scenario start destinations, but I think I now know what needs to be done - although I'm not sure how to point the route to look at my .dcsv files rather than those of the route dependencies, would anyone know which magic lines of text in which file I should be looking at potentially editing? This is more of a tidying up excercise rather than a necessity, so might end up being left out in the long grass.

I am now in a position to seriously consider the various release options available; ideally I want the easiest and most accessible method possible for everyone, but would also selfishly just like to know how many people have acquired the route. Hopefully I will be able to make a decision on that soon (I have time as the route is still being tested to make sure it all works ok) so it shouldn't be too long before this route emerges into the light of day. Possibly Workshop, possibly UKTS, possibly third-party website... hmmm so many options...

Exciting times ahead - more news as things develop!


ThePhantomPhish


** I've not removed the PP quarry blocks yet because there is no suitable alternative, but temporarily renaming my PP assets folder allowed me to see the route without them and actually, they are a nice enhancement but are not essential, so I will probably just delete them off (with a backup copy of the route should I find a way to reinstate them later)

*** Exeter-Kingswear (Riviera in the 50's) is still a current requirement but only for the whistle boards


* It took me a long time to get used to doing the required software editing with RWTools, but for those interested here's how it went...

Changing the route template, skies, and weather were no problem at all - and solved the mysterious issue I had been having with the route loading up dark in the world editor.
The terrain texture set swapping was indeed very easy, and the Falmouth branch textures matched perfectly - apart from the sand, which all turned to grass, but a simple bit of repainting along the coast sorted that out without headache.

Swapping the tracks caused some Dali-esque moments through my lack of experience - zero mile and hour speed limit signs, narrow gauge points on the standard gauge tracks and suchlike - but all those issues were corrected once I worked out where I had gone wrong in each case, which was always down to me swapping things for the wrong .bin files.

With the track and track rules all swapped, it all loaded up looking right, the speed limits were right, the points rendered correctly and so on. Hooray! I thought it was finally cracked. I unticked the Phorum Peninsula boxes in the providers list (let's ignore the quarry blocks asset for now), exited the editor, restarted Railworks just to be sure, and the route loaded up looking perfect again apart from the point levers being missing. It turns out that their .bin files needed swapping away from PP too but by then I knew what I was doing so that too was an easy fix.

But then I ran it through RWTools. To keep a very long story of frustration short, I could not for the life of me figure out why it was still looking for PP trackrule files. Eventually, the penny dropped, and I realised that it was still looking for the track rule that had been used for roads, walls and suchlike. Because the other lofts trackrules seem to have no effect on the actual running of the route there had been no reason for me to think they were 'missing'. Once that moment of clarity hit me, it was an easy job to swap the remaining PP track rule assets out. This was the crucial step that I had spent so long trying to figure out. Once you know what you are doing with RWTools it is really powerful, but it was so frustrating to think I was doing the right thing whilst overlooking the obvious!!
Hopefully that info may be of use to someone in the future if they ever struggle with the same issues I had!

Steve
~ Digital model railway engineer responsible for the North Wales Narrow Gauge Railways route ~
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xguerra
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Re: Jolly Good Fun ... Narrow Gauge rails in North Wales

Post by xguerra »

Having your destination markers appear in the list ingame is just a matter of placing them in a directory that will be ticked in the route.
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Re: Jolly Good Fun ... Narrow Gauge rails in North Wales

Post by gptech »

xguerra wrote:Having your destination markers appear in the list ingame is just a matter of placing them in a directory that will be ticked in the route.
The usual convention is ..\Assets\Provider(you)\Product(the route)\RouteMarkers

You'll also need a .bin file in the same directory pointing to the .dcsv, just look in any RSC/DTG route you have and copy the files (if needed) and edit to suit your route.
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Re: Jolly Good Fun ... Narrow Gauge rails in North Wales

Post by woodstockstrat1969 »

Great news. Can't wait for it to be available.
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Re: Jolly Good Fun ... Narrow Gauge rails in North Wales

Post by bailey7802 »

Same here, can't wait. The route looks fantastic :)
Will locomotives and coaching stock be available with the route when finished?
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Re: Jolly Good Fun ... Narrow Gauge rails in North Wales

Post by spontin »

bailey7802 wrote:Same here, can't wait. The route looks fantastic :)
Will locomotives and coaching stock be available with the route when finished?
I am trying to make that happen at the same time :D
Just in the final build for Taliesin cab, some testing and then packaging for a release.
Hopefully we can get the timings to coincide.

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TS2022 - FR & WHR Route & Rolling Stock
TS2022 - Talyllyn Adventure 2.1
MSTS Talyllyn Railway route
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Re: Jolly Good Fun ... Narrow Gauge rails in North Wales

Post by rabidcirquefan »

So excited for this release! It's great to see this project coming together. What is the current DLC requirement list?
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Re: Jolly Good Fun ... Narrow Gauge rails in North Wales

Post by xguerra »

rabidcirquefan wrote:So excited for this release! It's great to see this project coming together. What is the current DLC requirement list?
50's Riviera
WLOS Port Road
EU Community Asset Pack
J94 & Memories of Maerdy
Falmouth Branch (incl. AP Station Pack)
Doncaster Works
Settle & Carlisle
Corris Railway
Woodhead
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Re: Jolly Good Fun ... Narrow Gauge rails in North Wales

Post by bailey7802 »

I have everything but WLOS Which I believe is a separate addon?
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Re: Jolly Good Fun ... Narrow Gauge rails in North Wales

Post by thephantomphish »

Hi again folks!

Updates seem to be coming along reasonably regularly these days as the project reaches the final phases! I'm glad to see the continued interest!

Keeping what could have turned into a long post as short as possible...

1) I've now managed to create the location marker files and get the route to refer to them, I had to change some lines in the route properties file and am not sure quite what I did but it all seems to work as intended now. I wish I could explain what I did for anyone to refer to in the future, but it was very much trial and error based on the way other routes referenced their .dcsv files. This probably rules out any potential Workshop release for this particular incarnation of the route, although it would be possible to make changes and release a Workshop compatible version at a later date if desired. I've wanted to set up these location markers ever since I built the first three miles so I'm glad that is now finally sorted out!

2) Feeling empowered with RWTools, I've swapped the Kuju roads for S&C roads. Although the good people of Virtual Gwynedd have now lost their pavements the route looks a lot better for it, and I've been able to tidy up Britannia Bridge which was an awful mess of overlapping lofts. This lead me to look again at Porthmadog, which now looks relatively clumsy compared to the rest of the route - I'll be working on that area to bring it up to standard over the next few days, especially around the BR station end of town which was never originally intended to be so close to the narrow gauge lines.

3) The route requirements list above is correct but it is worth noting that the Riviera 50's route only provides the whistle boards - a really nice feature but a luxury rather than a necessity. All the other requirements have been assessed for removal but all provide some assets that the others don't, so I couldn't cut the list down any further.

4) It would be really good to co-ordinate the release of the route and the stock at the same time, I think we'll have to chat privately about timescales and how best to do it. I'm happy to try to write a few scenarios for the new stock, as the 15 or so currently included use a whole load of mixed freeware, payware, and PP stock.

5) Despite changing the tracks, nothing has been done that should have any effect on how the route functions - if the lucky few who have the most current version spot anything which doesn't work right, please let me know and I'll look into it - I'm bound to have missed something!

These final bits of improvements are to polish up the finished article rather than essential works ... so watch this space for more news regarding how and when the route will be released!

Thanks again for reading... more news should follow soon!


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Re: Jolly Good Fun ... Narrow Gauge rails in North Wales

Post by RolandBP »

I am looking forward to this route. :D
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Re: Jolly Good Fun ... Narrow Gauge rails in North Wales

Post by gptech »

thephantomphish wrote:1) I've now managed to create the location marker files and get the route to refer to them, I had to change some lines in the route properties file and am not sure quite what I did but it all seems to work as intended now. I wish I could explain what I did for anyone to refer to in the future, but it was very much trial and error based on the way other routes referenced their .dcsv files. This probably rules out any potential Workshop release for this particular incarnation of the route, although it would be possible to make changes and release a Workshop compatible version at a later date if desired. I've wanted to set up these location markers ever since I built the first three miles so I'm glad that is now finally sorted out!
All you need is a bin file file in a ..\Provider\Product\RouteMarkers folder, something along the lines of a folder named:

..\phantomphish\skinnywelshtrackroute\routeMarkers

would contain a skinnywelshtrackMarkers.bin file
which would point to a skinnywelshtrackMarkers.dcsv file in the same directory. This .dcsv file is just a big long list of locations and their lat and long, such as:

Code: Select all

<?xml version="1.0" encoding="utf-8"?>
<cCSVArray xmlns:d="http://www.kuju.com/TnT/2003/Delta" d:version="1.0" d:id="1240024">
	<CSVItem>
                <cCSVItem d:id="319100012">
			<X d:type="sFloat32" d:alt_encoding="0000000000000000" d:precision="string">-1.32030</X>
			<Y d:type="sFloat32" d:alt_encoding="0000000000000000" d:precision="string">51.06722</Y>
			<Name d:type="cDeltaString">Winchester</Name>
		</cCSVItem>
		<cCSVItem d:id="319100024">
			<X d:type="sFloat32" d:alt_encoding="0000000000000000" d:precision="string">-1.19276</X>
			<Y d:type="sFloat32" d:alt_encoding="0000000000000000" d:precision="string">50.85391</Y>
			<Name d:type="cDeltaString">Fareham</Name>
		</cCSVItem>
	</CSVItem>
</cCSVArray>
...no need to edit any other file, this (and all other marker .bin/,dcsv combinations in any Product/Provider enabled) would be loaded automatically, there's no need to make a reference to it anywhere else.
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