RSC Voyager in development

[rfletcher72]

Can I put this to the vote?

How many users purchase a model to actually drive - or do they just buy them for AI purposes?

I bought the RSC 321 primarily for AI use, the AP version can (in my opinion) make scenarios quite 'top heavy' when used in quantity.

And with one exception, all my steam locomotive DLC's were bought for AI use,

Regards,

[gptech]

Can I put this to the vote?

How many users purchase a model to actually drive - or do they just buy them for AI purposes?

I doubt there are any, but I'm sure there are a lot of folk who've bought models they very rarely drive. Take the 321 as an example: there are quite a number of members who have both versions, and I'd hazard a guess that most of that quite a number will drive the *better* version more than the DTG one.
My argument/reasoning was more to illustrate that *better* is something that changes depending on what you do with the supposedly *better* thing; and that one guys idea of *better* isn't a universal thing--david1 has said he'd buy a 175, 180 or 185; doesn't mean everybody would, as nice and welcome as those might be. I'd call for the *better* list of 124, 110 and as a real odd-ball a 128.

EDIT: Richard proves there's one... (at least)

[Traveller54]

EDIT: Richard proves there's one... (at least)

Make that two

[davep]

Preferring to drive a diesel, I often swap a steam loco for a diesel one (on the WLoS for example)
So I buy other locos - including steam - in the hope I can see all the AI trains the author of the
scenario has included.

[class377fcc12]

Rant Time. I have to say, the only thing I would buy it for is the physics. It may not just be me but it annoys me when you have to brake a mile before stations and then have the developer tell you the physics are realistic, even when they are outside the rulebook of the real railway. Also the body looks wrong somehow, it just doesn't stand well against my pictures of the real thing, also when has a voyager been to Devon without having an electrical failure? Rant Over.

[ashgray]

D'you know what? I just love the choice, the variety and the different experiences to be found in driving different versions of the same loco! Take the two currently available Class 67models for example, of which one is arguably "easier" to drive than the other: there are times when I'm well up for the challenge of the more complex one and other times when i just want an easier time of it, perhaps after a hard day at work. There are also times when I prefer the cab of one to the other, other times the opposite.

I'm fortunate in that I could afford to buy both and am glad that I bought both, for each gives me a different experience, neither being "better" than the other to me - just different. However, if funds had been an issue and I could only have afforded to have bought one or the other, then I'd have carefully picked through the opinions on here, in the light of my own preferences, and chosen accordingly. You cannot have too much choice, and I'm grateful for the fact that a sim that started out simply with just a Black 5, a Deltic and a Class 47 (I think that's all we had back in 2007!) has expanded to the point where there are actually very few loco classes or multiple units that are not available in one form or another.

I simply cannot understand that the degree of choice available to us could possibly be the basis of complaint by some members here. If there are two versions of the same loco, well just read, research, watch the developers' videos and buy the one you think will suit your purpose best. But please don't blame the manufacturers for placing you in that relatively comfortable position - that would be a little like complaining to Heinz that their baked beans don't taste as good as Branstons' baked beans. Let's face it - if you felt that way, you'd surely just buy Branstons' beans all the time and get on with your life. To continue the food analogy, the time for moaning might come if there's no food available at all.

To put all this in "real-life" context - TS2015 is simply a game, albeit one that is taken very seriously in some quarters. The cost of buying the new DTG Voyager, if you already have the one by JT, equates to around four pints of ale that you might like to drink (half a night out for some of my work colleagues)...

Just my two penny-worth.

Ash

[push2play]

I don't believe the question of choice is an issue here. It's the allocation of resources. The backlash against the Voyager seemingly stems from the fact that DTG are seen as "wasting" development time on a class that has already been done justice by another developer and didn't need to be replaced by an upgrade/sidegrade/downgrade. It seems a significant membership of the user base would appreciate DTG devoting its modelling time to classes that have not yet been produced and are seen as sorely lacking in the current landscape.

[Natvander]

Ah first world problems...

As this is DTG's game, why can't they make what they want? Most of us know they have a schedule of releases so I can't see them changing that because some third party developer has made one. There could be a whole range of issues as to why they're doing a 'duplicate' 220. What's more, if I was a developer I'd be making models to suit my business plan no matter how many of those models are on the market - other developers have done the same and it doesn't seem to cause such a stir...

I can't believe sometimes how this 'game' can seem to cause so many issues. Let's look at it, you sit in front of a screen pressing buttons. There are so many other more important issues today that need fixing.

And no I'm not a DTG fanboy - I have had absolutely nothing I want built (despite offering plans for everything Id like built to DTG), yet I still see this simulation for what it is and enjoy it.

[rfletcher72]

It seems a significant membership of the user base would appreciate DTG devoting its modelling time to classes that have not yet been produced and are seen as sorely lacking in the current landscape.

I haven't seen any comments from any 'significant' section of the 'user base' in all honesty. What I have seen are a number of vociferous comments from some individuals on this forum and on other forms of social media, the number of which I am willing to bet forms a tiny, tiny proportion of the total current TS user base and therefore potential market for this DLC.

I am also willing to bet that no-one at DG will be losing any sleep over the prospects for their version,

Regards,

Richard

[davejc64]

The issue of DTG 'wasting their time' to produce a version of a already existing model is easily addressed, it is after all said and done their time to waste.

[michaelhendle]

Hi
I'm afraid i'm in the minority here but I prefer to use DTG models over the far better ones available,because I can get them to run with know problem.

As said before due to a stroke I have problems understanding instructions for the advanced models I have the AP Cl 90,CL 321 and Cl 142 of the 3 I can only get Cl 142 to work,it's a shame they can't be set up so that you can have the choice to use the basic HUD or the advanced system.

I would have bought some more JT models as quite few were basic models to start with,but now they are all advanced,a pity they didn't keep the originals as well at least then people could have the choice.If they had kept them they could have had more sales,I would have bought them.

I would like to thank G P tech for his help trying to get class 90 and 321 to work,even writing the instructions down I still can't get them to move

Mike

[Fincra5]

I just personally see it is a waste

In truth, I think many UKTS members who've been around the game since 'Ye Olden Dayes' will agree with that, but we do tend to think of ourselves as the 'mainstream' TS users/players/simmers.
Still, things like this do make for *interesting* discussions, it's just a shame that some immediately trash a DTG release based on a single WIP photograph. Of course anything from DTG is unlikely to reach the giddy heights of realism offered by the more advanced, highly scripted stock 3rd parties have released but that's not always a bad thing---as evidenced by Michael's post above.

We always read calls that instead of producing this, that and the other they should concentrate on fixing core issues--it has merit, but do the modellers/artists at DTG have the necessary programming skills to do that? Probably not, so let them carry on with the modelling and leave the code tinkering to those with very pale complexions and bags under their eyes

You sir do make some good points.

As you can guess I won't be buying it... But I wished for the other that they didn't just have 1 livery, as i'm sure we can imagine they'd so a livery pack and charge again for it. Unlike the JT one which came with a variety (I know the 220 only had 2 liveries but still..)

[msmith4000]

I don't believe the question of choice is an issue here. It's the allocation of resources. The backlash against the Voyager seemingly stems from the fact that DTG are seen as "wasting" development time on a class that has already been done justice by another developer and didn't need to be replaced by an upgrade/sidegrade/downgrade. It seems a significant membership of the user base would appreciate DTG devoting its modelling time to classes that have not yet been produced and are seen as sorely lacking in the current landscape.

I would agree. The model wont be better than JT version or as good value and with a backlog of bugs to fix and plenty of other services stuff not done before it does seem a waste of time. However I suspect it wil sell well as there are probably more customers who only buy from steam than customers who buy from many sources.

For me having multiple versions of rolling stock just confuses matters and makez the sim more difficult to work with and get scenarios to work . . .

Wont be buying as it is just too much to pay for workshop capability.

[rfletcher72]

The model wont be better than JT version or as good value and with a backlog of bugs to fix and plenty of other services stuff not done before it does seem a waste of time

That is some degree of foresight you possess. Can you possibly stretch to posting this coming weekends lottery numbers? ,

Regards,

Richard

[michaelhendle]

Hi
How can you say that the RSC Voyager will not be as good as the JT Voyager,the only time you can judge it is when the model is released,and also you can't judge value for money as RSC haven't given it a price yet.

I expect it will sell as not every one wants the hassle of pushing and pulling buttons and levers,I for one just want to get into cab,release the brakes,put in forward and open the throttle.

Mike