WCML Over Shap From Keith Ross

[Varney]

Just how much longer is this kind chap Mr Ross going to keep us waiting

I don't think the delay is down to Keith, but Dovetail (RSC) & Steam.

[Rockdoc2174]

Can we take it then that WCML-S will be coming with a suitably equipped 87 and if so, does this mean that there will have to be separate player and AI versions, or does the trip-out only apply to locos being run as player

On Facebook, Keith said that the included 87 is revamped over the current model.

Keith

[ttjph]

It would seem neutral sections have finally been implemented

Eh WCML-North had the signs and magnets in place for them all along. You mean to say people ignored them when playing? Amateurs or what!

Would some kind person care to post a quick guide for us amateurs as to what signs we're looking for (I think I know this one!), where they're located in relation to the neutral section, and exactly what's required in terms of driving technique? Is it acceptable to go straight to 'off', or should we spend three-quarters of a mile running-down all the way?

[220389]

It would seem neutral sections have finally been implemented

Eh WCML-North had the signs and magnets in place for them all along. You mean to say people ignored them when playing? Amateurs or what!

Would some kind person care to post a quick guide for us amateurs as to what signs we're looking for (I think I know this one!), where they're located in relation to the neutral section, and exactly what's required in terms of driving technique? Is it acceptable to go straight to 'off', or should we spend three-quarters of a mile running-down all the way?

At about Section 18.18 http://www.railsigns.co.uk/sect18page1/sect18page1.html

When you get to the black board marker you would cut power and let the power meter thing go to zero in such things as the 87. Modern stock i believe it is automatic?

Chris

[Alicatt]

Which then brings the question: What happens if you inadvertently stop with the pantograph in the neutral section?

[1S811985]

Which then brings the question: What happens if you inadvertently stop with the pantograph in the neutral section?

If art really does imitate life then it'll be game over!

To speculate, it may be that only the first magnet is active and trips the loco out if it's under power when it passes over it. So there should be nothing to stop you getting underway again.

1S81

[749006]

Which then brings the question: What happens if you inadvertently stop with the pantograph in the neutral section?

If art really does imitate life then it'll be game over!
To speculate, it may be that only the first magnet is active and trips the loco out if it's under power when it passes over it. So there would be nothing to stop you getting underway again.

1S81

Not really game over - only if you were on level track otherwise you would just roll out - one way or other.
Also the Dead part is not much more than about two metres long - so you would have to be really unlucky to stop in it.
http://railsimroutes.net/photos/mk3_neu ... tion_1.jpg
The white sections are made of ceramic beads which insulate them from the power supply.

Regarding shutting off power for a Neutral section - With Emu's and modern locos 90,91,92, you can just close the power handle as you approach but if the 90/91 is pushing then you might get a snatch if you close power too quickly.
With the 86 & 87 you need to run power down so you are at Off when you run thru the neutral. If you still have power on then the ABB (Air Blast Breaker) on the roof will trip but you will have to wait until the Tapchanger runs back to Notch 0 before getting power again.

Peter

[AndyUK]

....... If you still have power on then the ABB (Air Blast Breaker) on the roof will trip but you will have to wait until the Tapchanger runs back to Notch 0 before getting power again.

Not sure if you meant that the breaker will only open if you enter the Neutral Section with power on, but it could be read that way and it's not true. The breaker will open on passing over the first set of magnets irrespective of whether the loco is taking power or not.

Andy L

[Kromaatikse]

You could watch Keith's fifth preview video to see what the tutorial will cover.

For the 87 as modelled specifically:

- The BLACK -[]- sign is the advance warning, which is positioned at approximately the appropriate location to begin to RUN DOWN the notches, assuming you are at high power and full line speed. Experience will tell you how to modify technique from that starting point.

Running down the notches beforehand serves two purposes: eliminating the jolt as a high power application is suddenly removed; and avoiding the lengthy delay with power unavailable while the notches run back after the neutral section. It is not required, just good technique.

- The WHITE -[]- sign is positioned just before the neutral section itself, and you should place the controller in OFF here.

- The track magnets will trip the main breaker off, then back on again - about 1 second apart at 100+ mph, longer if slower. The Line light will go out and the blowers will shut down during this interval. The notches will continue to run down if required.

- After the breaker comes back on, the usual prerequisites must be met before power can be regained - controller in OFF, notches at ZERO. You may then proceed directly to RUN UP if line speed is sufficient to justify this.

As an aside, the controller notches are now named as such on the HUD. I hope this will improve discoverability for new "sparks" drivers.

In real life, if you came to a halt with the breaker tripped and could not coast forward out of trouble, you would need to examine the pantograph to see which side of the insulated section it had landed, and proceed accordingly. As modelled, the insulated section does not functionally exist (boo...) and you can thus simply use PanUp/Reset to reset the breaker and regain power. You'll need to do so again after passing the second magnet.

For modern Thyristor and Inverter based locos, it takes much less time to remove power smoothly. You can therefore take the BLACK sign as advisory, and smoothly remove power once the WHITE sign is in sight (but before you pass it). You can then regain power immediately once the Line light toggles back on (assuming single pan involved).

[firetrap1]

If I could make a point about the class 87 and 86 tap-changers,

It takes me under 15 seconds to go from full power to 'off' when using the run-down notch in open countryside. However, at the same time it also takes a lot longer in comparison around built up areas were my fps drop.

Therefore it seems like the animation of the needle in cab is linked to fps???

[tubemad]

I charge through neutral sections on a 390 on full power, as I thought it sorts itself out? Electric locos I do though, more entertaining and something to do, even though they are currently not 'active' so to speak.

Anyone watched the Euston - Liverpool Railscene cab ride? The inspector bloke was talking about a neutral section conveniently placed right before a signal! Once a loco stopped at the signal that was red and stopped under the neutral section and got stuck!

[AndyUK]

If I could make a point about the class 87 and 86 tap-changers,

It takes me under 15 seconds to go from full power to 'off' when using the run-down notch in open countryside. However, at the same time it also takes a lot longer in comparison around built up areas were my fps drop.

Therefore it seems like the animation of the needle in cab is linked to fps???

You're right about the tap changer speed being frame rate dependent in the versions of the 86 & 87 released so far, it should take around 30 sec to go from 0% to 100% and vice-versa. I run with the frame rate locked at 30 so I've edited the scripts to suit.

However looking at the effort that Kromaatiske has put in on the WCML Over Shap version I'd not be surprised to find that the dependency on frame rate has been removed.

Andy L

[Kromaatikse]

Indeed it has. That was one of the earlier changes to go in, as it was rather noticeable on my best computer.

Even with modern stock, you should close the power controller yourself for neutral sections, since otherwise the passengers will get jolted. In any case you would need to close and re-open the controller to regain power. The only real difference compared to older stock is that you don't have to anticipate it so early.

[GavNormandale]

Would it not make it more realistic to make the track non-electrified for that short section?

[FoggyMorning]

Would it not make it more realistic to make the track non-electrified for that short section?

The way the "Dispatcher" is currently configured, it will not allow passage of electric motive power over any sections of non-electrified track.