Class 08 coming out on steam soon

[SquidvT]

may actually have a go at purchasing the ECMl section from Grantham?

I have the BR era version and I love it. Its not a massive route but obviously part two is in the making and will attach to part one. Ive heard some say its a bit boring, which I dont see really. Its a nice long drag strip for thrashing locos on.

[bdy26]

The 66 was at least a new model.

I've not bought any RSC home produced DLC since the issue of the SPT 101 and the refusal to correct the glowing interior of the original which is not fit for purpose.

If you're unhappy with the approach, don't buy their stuff. Plenty of 3rd party providers out there.

I'd love to support RSC to help develop the core game but not if this is their approach. I hope it changes.

B

[SouthernElectric]

I haven't bought anything from RSC for ages having spent heavily in the past, and I am sure there are plenty of others like me. There may be enough new users to take advantage of right now, but this well will run dry as will the goodwill.

Very much the same thing here Andy, last DLC item I bought was the London to Brighton route and that was only because I work at Brighton, Just Trains and DT still get my money as they treat me as a customer and not a cash cow.
Simon

[pacerfan]

Just found something interesting for those of us who own up the junction the mapping is exactly the same so it can be a case of copy and paste to the woodhead 08. I am working on my own re-texture so others can use it but if you are not afraid of a little bin editing then it's a quick way to get a freighliner 08

[220389]

First of all wait until it is release before jumping to conclusions, as no one but RSC knows what is happening with this product.

The 66 was at least a new model.

I've not bought any RSC home produced DLC since the issue of the SPT 101 and the refusal to correct the glowing interior of the original which is not fit for purpose.

If you're unhappy with the approach, don't buy their stuff. Plenty of 3rd party providers out there.

I'd love to support RSC to help develop the core game but not if this is their approach. I hope it changes.

B

That is very fair and is the best thing to do. Although a lot seem more content on moaning about it, instead of ignoring and not buying it. Doesn't put this forum in a good light with new users.

I agree with this completely. I too have spent heavily in the past but almost nothing in the last 6 months.

The current strategy from RSC comes as no surprise. Let's not forget that more recent developments in the sim have been firmly pitched at attracting new users, Fisher Price HUD, Xbox controller support, relay play, career scenarios? None of these were ever requested by hardcore established users like us lot here and on other forums. These developments were aimed purely and simply at maximising the reach of the game as far and wide as possible and pulling in regular gamers. It stands to reason then that DLC will follow the same path and what easier way to sell stuff to newbies than re-packaging existing DLC with a few minor tweaks and re-selling it?

I can fully understand the reasons why RSC are tempted down this road but it's a risky strategy as pointed out by Andy above. Look after your established customers first and foremost. If you lose their buy-in then things will go rapidly belly up once the newbies and regular gamers lose interest (which they will and quickly too). You have to be seriously into trains and simulation to stick around with a niche product like this. If you're a mainstream gamer dabbling then there is simply not enough in the locker of any simulation to keep your interest for long.

Yes the current way of repackaging DLC is a bad move but many companies do worse things. E.g. Activison with Call of Duty series + map packs (My own opioin though)

I don't understand many peoples hatred towards the newer F3/F4 hud yes it isn't like it was before but things have to involve to keep people using it.

Xbox Controller support, What is wrong with that though? i understand you dislike it for some reason, but it makes the game more entry level friendly for many pc gamers, who haven't got a big interest in Train Sim's or new to simulators in general, as a lot of pc gamers own a 360 pad. I know most of the other sim's i play support gamepads in one way or the other, including one that orginally dates back to 2001 and all later releases off it.

Overal what is wrong with trying to get newer players into it or casual gamers, it allows future funding for other projects and potentionally more free upgrades to the latest verison of Railworks/TS.

Many forums i have found do worse for turning away new users then RSC are themselves with the complete and utter slating and bashing of it in all ways and manors. Other offical game forums have a similar small section of players, one being Red Orchestra 2 and people complaining and moaning that the future standalone addon Rising Storm will be a paid for addon, but most forget there will be a limited free verison for all RO2 owners anyway.

[SquidvT]

Although a lot seem more content on moaning about it, instead of ignoring and not buying it. Doesn't put this forum in a good light with new users.

Well this is a forum for discussing all things TS2013, and I think its fair enough that we can voice our opinion over RSCs marketing strategy. Take a look at their facebook page, it too is swamped with similar and a lot harsher comments. By making our opinions clear perhaps RSC will take note and change. As for new users, well I would be pleased to know that there are alternatives to this pack that offer far more value.

Xbox Controller support, What is wrong with that though? i understand you dislike it for some reason, but it makes the game more entry level friendly for many pc gamers, who haven't got a big interest in Train Sim's or new to simulators in general, as a lot of pc gamers own a 360 pad. I know most of the other sim's i play support gamepads in one way or the other, including one that orginally dates back to 2001 and all later releases off it.

Overal what is wrong with trying to get newer players into it or casual gamers, it allows future funding for other projects and potentionally more free upgrades to the latest verison of Railworks/TS.

I agree 100% that any franchise should do its upmost to encourage new users and also innovate.

Personally the new hud doesnt bother me, I dont use it, same for Xbox controls. But I think I do understand why people complain about these features. Its basically because they cater to the new player and there is so little being done to satisfy older more serious users. Improved physics, easier editing and many other things that have been asked for for years seem to fall on deaf ears, whilst apparent gimmicks seem to take precedent.

Other offical game forums have a similar small section of players, one being Red Orchestra 2 and people complaining and moaning that the future standalone addon Rising Storm will be a paid for addon, but most forget there will be a limited free verison for all RO2 owners anyway.

I also agree that a cursory look at other forums will reveal that the sport of choice seems to be dev bashing. I will say one thing though, Tripwire Interactive have a fantastic reputation for listening to their existing user base. They have publicly admitted and apologised when they get it wrong and try to satisfy the demands of the community (A almost impossible task). RSC on the other hand seem to prefer to remain aloof, there is very little if any direct communication other than their various adverts on facebook. RSC would do well to take a leaf from Tripwires book when it comes to community feedback, involvement and consultation.

Finally look at the amount of praise that 3rd party devs get on these boards. When devs deliver (this includes RSC) they are praised highly and defended.

[theorganist]

I too like the "fisher price" HUD but then again I appear to be a Facebook Kiddie (37) who likes plastic rubbish (as well as every type of railway traction from the last fifty years), so probably not someone to be taken seriously!

The forums are becoming a tedious place to be!

Peter

[theorganist]

RSC on the other hand seem to prefer to remain aloof, there is very little if any direct communication other than their various adverts on facebook. RSC would do well to take a leaf from Tripwires book when it comes to community feedback, involvement and consultation.

RSC have also vastly improved the game from the beginnings, people don't seem to want to acknowledge that anymore! I could not imagine playing the original Rail Simulator or even the first Railworks now. For me it runs smoother, I love the graphic effects, the sounds have improved. I imagine DLC sales have funded much of this.

Peter

[220389]

I also agree that a cursory look at other forums will reveal that the sport of choice seems to be dev bashing. I will say one thing though, Tripwire Interactive have a fantastic reputation for listening to their existing user base. They have publicly admitted and apologised when they get it wrong and try to satisfy the demands of the community (A almost impossible task). RSC on the other hand seem to prefer to remain aloof, there is very little if any direct communication other than their various adverts on facebook. RSC would do well to take a leaf from Tripwires book when it comes to community feedback, involvement and consultation.

Finally look at the amount of praise that 3rd party devs get on these boards. When devs deliver (this includes RSC) they are praised highly and defended.

I agree that RSC should take a leaf out of TWI's book. TWI being one company i will always support and rare for a dev' to come out and publicly apologised for the disasterous release of RO2. For which i know quite a few of the devs from there as well.

I have seen the praise that 3rd parties get and it is brillant, also some do get critised but the dev's do listern and will fix it. Just hope that RSC can become more like TWI. (Plug i recommend looking at Rising Storm footage etc)

Chris

[SquidvT]

RSC have also vastly improved the game from the beginnings, people don't seem to want to acknowledge that anymore! I could not imagine playing the original Rail Simulator or even the first Railworks now. For me it runs smoother, I love the graphic effects, the sounds have improved. I imagine DLC sales have funded much of this.

Yes you are right, Graphically and performance wise they have made great inroads. Although at least a part of this is that technology can handle their code easier now. But ill repeat what I said there are things that many have been crying out for, and wouldnt be hard to impeliment. MSTS actually featured them, so there are no technical reasons that RSC shouldnt be able to match such an old title. I guess its down to priorities and whilst we would applaud any improvement, its the details that matter.

Dont get me wrong, I spend many hours enjoying TS, but theres always that niggling doubt as to what the purpose of the project is. When I see releases like the forthcoming 08 "pack" it suggests that the number one might be profit rather than making a solid core engine and game.

[styckx]

Just because the core has `improved' (and that's purely an opinion depending on who you talk to and what your definition of "improvements" is) doesn't mean we're supposed to look the other way when they find leftover meatloaf in the back of the fridge, dump a bottle of gravy over it, stick it in the microwave and call it a new meal.

[theorganist]

Just because the core has `improved' (and that's purely an opinion depending on who you talk to and what your definition of "improvements" is) doesn't mean we're supposed to look the other way when they find leftover meatloaf in the back of the fridge, dump a bottle of gravy over it, stick it in the microwave and call it a new meal.

No one is forcing you to eat the meatloaf but presumably plenty are! I just give my money to other developers if I don't think rsc offer value, ie will I use it enough to make it worthwhile?

And the improvements are my opinion based on my experience which for me is as valid as anyone elses!

Peter

[hertsbob]

The forums are becoming a tedious place to be!
Peter

Yep.

[tobymiller1]

One of the main audiences of RSC is the younger group, around 13 onwards. It is a shame as the only recent product I have bought is L2B, and I just cant afford it. I really want both 66's, L2F, 465 and now this (if it was cheaper and not such a rip off). This would all cost £72 when I used to be able to get an 08 pack, shed pack and unit with a whole load of skins for cheaper.

The thing is, people say you dont have to buy it, thats exactly right although this is annoying. Such as the Class 66. As this has been made, 3rd party companies would not challenge to make one as it would not be as profitable, so it lies in the middle between having a model there thats just good enough, and not making a other one that would be profitable.

Its also the fact that they could have made something that doesn't exist yet that would be more profitable and worth while, such as a class 442. This is just so essential and it is probably (tell me if I am wrong) the highest demand unit that in moment in time.

Toby

[tomtrain]

Perhaps we should move back on topic before the omnipotent wrath of the mods comes down on this thread?

For any of you that haven't noticed, the pack is now out on Steam, with 25% off until May 1st:

http://store.steampowered.com/app/222578/

Also comes with MEA and MFA wagons