Atomic Systems

Story I've heard (truth unknown) is Collet simply took a model of a King, stuck some modelers clay on it to design the shape and had it built.

Although the streamlining might be a joke, in other ways that Castle looks more like the later County class...

(Have to say that the SR attempt was little better )

Some things are just plain wrong! I can see where 0 Gauge Hornby tinplate designers got some of their ideas from now

There were some Kings that were streamlined too... I'm guessing it wouldn't be too difficult to use child objects to streamline the existing models!!!

...not sure why anyone would want to though... there were flammin' ugly!!!!!

OZINOZ wrote:...... unfortunately never seen one run on my UK trips (did see Sir Nigel in 10,000 pieces on one trip at Bewdley on the SVR under overhaul back in the 90's..

Interesting; I have never seen an A4 'alive' either but I too did see Sir Nigel, well not in 10,000 pieces but actually only the complete frame, wheels and skirting from the running board down, in Carnforth in 1983 Must have had a major overhaul then too, getting a new boiler and such. Pity for me, but on the same occasion I was able to see "Flying Scotsman', 'Leander' and a maroon (? if I remember well) Ivatt Class 2 Mickey Mouse all in full splendour, which more than compensated for Sir Nigel in pieces at the time. Must still have some pictures somewhere.

Jos

black8 wrote:

OZINOZ wrote:...... unfortunately never seen one run on my UK trips (did see Sir Nigel in 10,000 pieces on one trip at Bewdley on the SVR under overhaul back in the 90's..

Interesting; I have never seen an A4 'alive' either but I too did see Sir Nigel, well not in 10,000 pieces but actually only the complete frame, wheels and skirting from the running board down, in Carnforth in 1983 Must have had a major overhaul then too, getting a new boiler and such. Pity for me, but on the same occasion I was able to see "Flying Scotsman', 'Leander' and a maroon (? if I remember well) Ivatt Class 2 Mickey Mouse all in full splendour, which more than compensated for Sir Nigel in pieces at the time. Must still have some pictures somewhere.

Jos

Probably Sir Nigel's overhaul just before being allocated to railtours on S&C. I've had the pleasure of being behind Sir Nigel on the North Yorkshire Moors Railway on 3 different occasions in the last 10 years, though one year it was in general overhaul and they were raising money to sort its boiler out again. Also had the opportunity to be up close and dirty with Bittern at NYMR aswell at a steam gala around 4-5years ago, also had the nice pleasure of sampling 5 different black 5s that gala to.

Of course I've seen Mallard oodles amount of times at York aswell as the brief time at Shildon, the time at Shildon was just after it had been moved to so all the side coverings on the drivers were off and it was dripping oil around itself, they also had the massive brake cloth blocks on display showing the ones from the 1980s prior to it finally retiring and a new pair added for the move.

AlistairS wrote:There were some Kings that were streamlined too... I'm guessing it wouldn't be too difficult to use child objects to streamline the existing models!!!

...not sure why anyone would want to though... there were flammin' ugly!!!!!

Only one, Henry VII. Over to you Mr Chomdley-Warner!
http://www.britishpathe.com/video/strea ... a-nutshell

Nah, didnt do them any favours did it? In the end they stripped it all off, though the v shaped cab windscreen (which actually looked quite nice) was retained till the end.

Surely with computer simulations it'd be pretty easy to test the effectiveness of the streamlining on different locos. Presumably something a railway magazine could look into. You could then obtain a comparable resistance between the A4, Coronation, Henry VII/Manorbier Castle and an airsmoothed merchant navy. You could also then compare with the non-streamlined variants as well just to see the effectiveness over the standard variants.

Surprised it's not been done already really. Instead it seems we have to rely on the wind tunnel testing at the time of models, and their perceived effectiveness in service, and by just look at them.

Ive been trying in vain to find a system to determine wind resistance of the King class, just so I can try and setup the locomotive to accurate performance, and Im damned if I can find anything. If anyone does know of something out there that can calculate drag Id be appreciative.

On the face of it I suspect aerodynamically the A4 had everything else beat. Im sure I recall somewhere that Gresley was friends with a car designer (Bugatti?) and leaned on his experience when designing A4. As for the Duchess's, I think they looked better than credited, but when streamlined examples seemed capable of topping 114mph, you kind of wonder why they bothered...

I think the streamlined King and Castle were an example of Colletts somewhat strange (and it would appear under appreciated) sense of humour. Im pretty sure he didnt intend it to be applied across the fleet, just to . a snoop at the GWR board. He did it again a few years alter, when pressed to rename some of the locomotives after the GWR board, he had everyone turn up at paddington to see one of the newly renamed machines, which turned out to be a double framed (and distinctly ancient looking) Dukedog if memory serves. The board was unimpressed, and he was then subsequently pressed to rename various castles instead, but I think he made his point.

Charles Collett was an austere, but on the quiet a very funny man I think.

stuart666 wrote:On the face of it I suspect aerodynamically the A4 had everything else beat. Im sure I recall somewhere that Gresley was friends with a car designer (Bugatti?) and leaned on his experience when designing A4.

Quite possibly Bugatti, considering it was both the Flying Hamburger and Bugatti railcars, in Germany and France respectively, that provided him with the inspiration to design the A4s.

Chris

Hence why the streamlined front end of the A4 was known as the Bugatti Nose :p

*NOT a snowplough*

I didn't know about the Bugatti design connection, interesting.




What loco could this have inspired?

Easy... Thompson A2

Looks more like a Class 70 to me!

That's what I thought