Slowing and stopping!!

[jimmyshand]

Getting a Raildriver console is the best way to master perfect stops. Having fine control over braking and being able to operate an actual handle on/off/on/off in tiny amounts as much as you need is probably the best part of having a Raildriver. You can see and feel what position the brake is in instantly. If you want half brake you just push the brake handle half way, almost impossible to make half brake applications by pressing keys. You never accurately know where your brake handle is when pressing a key and you have to keep verifying by looking at what the animated handle is doing or reading gauges/HUD, with Raildriver you can make pinpoint accurate stops simply because you can work and carress the handle without looking at anything!!

To use a Flight Sim analogy again, how hard would it be to land a jetliner by pressing keys for the throttle? You need a proper joystick throttle that you can work on and off constantly to stand a decent chance, same goes for Raildriver.

[ttjph]

It's a bit of a cheat, but I've created a spreadsheet with a graph showing distance to stop versus speed, for a range of deceleration values (v^2 = 2as, rearranged to v = sqrt(2*a*s) where v = velocity (speed), a = acceleration (or deceleration here) and s = distance).

As I approach a stop I know from experience roughly which curve my current train will follow at full service, so I note the speed I'm doing, read across the graph to find the corresponding distance, add a bit to allow for the time taken to actually apply the brakes, subtract a bit because I want to go past the start of the platform, then at the appropriate distance take the brakes to full service, sit back and cross my fingers! It's the only way to keep time in a Class 166 scenario...

It's not quite perfect (the speed doesn't quite follow the square-root curve due to aero drag and other effects) but in the absence of having driven the same service day in, day out for months it's very helpful to get in the right zone.

[larch]

I'd love a rail driver! I'll get one one day, when the wife's not looking. Braking is tricky. It's not prototypical, but my starting point technique is use a comparison of speed with distance in a rough algorithm that goes something like this:

Start braking at distance = speed minus 10 with the decimal point moved two places to the left.

For example, if you're travelling at 90 mph start braking at 0.8 miles to the platform stop point.

You keep this up so that at 80 you're at 0.7 and at 70 mph you're at 0.6, but you need make adjustments that will see you cross the platform threshold at 30 - 35mph for a main line station (about 0.3) I find I often have to ease off braking as I approach the platform.

Combine this with a experience based learning about the line, gradient, station and loco etc. Some modern locos have notches with sharper braking force distinctions than others, and steam locos are much harder to brake smoothly than modern traction until you've learned how far and fast [;] and ['] work on the brake. That varies from loco to loco and designer to designer, so experiment!

The above approach usually leads to the braking force being about 50% of maximum, but not always. I've always assumed that's about right. It also depends on the timetable in the scenario - some require heavy braking and fast acceleration (locals, usually), others work well with earlier braking and a lower braking force (long distance expresses, often). Keep an eye on the ETA and work out what the scenario designer has served you up.

Eventually, when you've sorted yourself out with a given loco, timetable and route, you can often set the brake a just the right place to bring you to a stop with no further adjustment, which is a very sweet!

I used to love using Dorset Coast and so wish it was available for TS12. I'm afraid to say I can't bring myself to use MSTS any more (shame - all that money invested in routes etc!). But you really want to try the route you can get MSTS for a fiver, the Coast for not much more, and loads of updates and scenarios for nout!

Best of luck.

Simon Spoerer

[Kariban]

The problem with using full-service all the time ( ignoring passenger comfort! ) is that if you've started braking too late, you've got no more brakes. 166s probably *were* originally meant to be braked in step 3 - which is full service, the contemporary EMU training vids I've seen say as much and they used the same brakes... but that does rely on you not messing up, ever. Drivers I've spoken to more recently have said they're told to use step 2 for three-step brakes, so think of that as around 2/3ds of the available brake for anything else.

30mph isn't a bad target for the platform ramp, depends on the platform length though!

Watched a load of steam-era video recently, they seem to just throw it all in :p it's a wonder passengers never got whiplash.

[firetrap1]

Here is a good tip:

When driving a long train (hst or 6 car DMU), Always aim to be slowing just around 30mph as you start to enter the station. By the time you reach the end of the platform you should be around 5-10mph, making it easy to stop comfortably within platform limits.

Chris

[bdy26]

25-30mph is about right but don't forget the gradient in the station will have an effect on your stopping distance. Stock with more complex systems like the 86 or EM1 may switch between systems at lower speed, and with the 86 you may need to release the brake earlier than you think as the switch to air brake grabs a bit.

On approach to the platform you should get your speed to what you want it to be with your brake in Running position, before braking again to a stand.

Be ready to apply power if you are going to stop short - on steam drop the cut off into the 60s, on the 86 have the tap changer on Hold so you can put a notch in quickly.

Always come to a stand with the brake being released ("stopping on a rising brake") then when stationary make a full application.

B

[Trucker01]

Wow! You guys have been so helpful! Thanks again! I will download the Portsmouth Direct Line expansion pack this evening. Is it a straight forward download and install or is it tricky for the not so I.T literate people among us! I'm OK to an extent but ZIP files and installing to the correct folder is one place I struggle!

[gypbrc]

The Portsmouth Route is a DLC item. Just so you are fully aware it costs £24.99.

Click the 'Add to Cart' button and you'll be asked to sign into Steam (if you're not already). Then pay for it and it'll automatically download and install itself into TS2012. The route will then be available for selection in the main menu where you can play the ten scenarios that come included.

[Trucker01]

Thanks Rich. I have signed up to there. I have also ought a few items off of there already too. However, their systems aren't working at the moment for purchases it would seem. Rather annoying. I had a nice little cart ready to buy up but can't now. Anyone else having this problem?

[Inthernet]

I consider the Class 450 that comes with the Portsmouth Direct Line as "broken" as RSC have still not fixed the problems which manifested with the upgrade to TS2012. Quite a pity because it comes with loads of scenarios! I've tweaked mine for more power...

The default Class 166 is chronically under-braked. Its notch 3 deceleration rate is prototypical of notch 2 for other rolling stock. I have the braking distance memorised though.

Say you're doing 80mph with the 166 and whack on full braking at 0.7 indicated (0.75 actual) miles out. You should adjust your braking such that at:

At 0.5 miles indicated, you should be doing 74mph,
0.4 / 65mph
0.3 / 57mph
0.2 / 47mph

My video at the 9 minute mark demonstrates this clearly. I gently start applying the brakes at 76.8mph when I'm 0.6 indicated. Once the speeds are synchronised with the above table, I apply notch 3 for a perfect stop.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fm0m6BZKu7Y

This formula works with the Class 156 and 455 when using notch 2. On the Class 170, it will be approx 44% application. My eyes have become used at the rate in which the numbers change so I can replicate it with other locos thorough intuition!

[gypbrc]

Yes, I should have mentioned the 'broken' class 450. It's a shame this hasn't been fixed yet. Perhaps you'd like to take a look at one of Kariban's recent posts; I think he summed up the most popular routes quite well.

As for braking; I mostly drive the DMU's. Half of the technique is knowing the route and the other half is knowing the loco/unit.

In a similar vein to the above post:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ot69PtUZo8Y

[Griphos]

Edinburgh - Glasgow with a 170, from 100 mph. shut off power 1 mile from station, enter station at 25 - 28 mph, step 2 braking and stop cab at 3 car marker, "perfick"
Or if you've got a six car set, stop at the 6 car marker, ( obviously, )

Chris.

There are markers?!?! Is this just on the E-G route? I didn't know about markers!

This is a very interesting thread. I've been working on my braking, and very much appreciate the analogy to landing when flying. I think that's got it just right. Always the hardest and most important part! And takes the most skill and knowledge of your craft.

[dp123]

It really depends on the train too. The default Class 37 has utterly comedy brakes akin to reverse thrust and deploying a drogue 'chute. A quick flick of the brake handle into what would probably be "Initial" practically dumps the brake pipe pressure and throws you through a virtual windscreen.

[Trucker01]

I'm glad my first topic has been of use to other members on here! Always good to hear some positive feedback.

Again guys, thank you so much for all your hep and comments regarding everything I asked about! Seems like I have found the right forum for Train Sim 2012 and the other variants.

Look forward to learning more from you all.

Jon

[gptech]

If I recall correctly, one of our resident real drivers (Pacerpilot maybe?) stated that they (at least for the TOC he worked for) were instructed that 12mph was the maximum speed to run at when a platform was reached.