Alerter Sound

[pjt1974]

Gald I'm not the only one not to hear the alerter outside the cab.
I stopped taking my 'modern' steam loco's for a run along 'modern' lines because I like to drive them with the wind whistling through my receeding hairline and it's annoying suddenly grinding to a halt.

[lateagain]

Snipe away I've been sniped at by experts.... but the fact remains that there is an issue here that as has been suggested is fixable? Fixing ALL the stock this applies to would probably best be done by Steam?

Why shouldn't folk discuss other simulators? We're discussing software here and Simulation is a long established sector of software. Simulation was being programmed before anyone had ever dreamt of "Personal Computers" and as each generation of Simulator has evolved each has sought to bring more facilities on board. Frankly the "Footie Fan" "My simulator is better than your Simulator" attitude will get you nowhere fast. Simulation on PC's has developed because folk with some creative analysis, if not the no-how to answer their own questions, have asked Why can't it do this? and wouldn't it be good if we can make it do that! If Ford and Volswagen make Air Con standard on all their cars where do you suppose General Motors Sales would be if they listened to all who said "You don't need that..."

The software is NOT a holy grail! It is, or rather it SHOULD be, a "work in progress".

IMHO far too often on the RW forums there has been a negative attitude to any suggestion that there is a problem or that this or that could be improved. Do you think Microsoft could have sold X versions of Office if they'd adopted such an attitude to feedback? Of course they couldn't.

All too often any issue raised here is greeted by dozens of posts saying stuff along the lines of "I'm happy with it..." or "I don't see the problem..." both responses being neither constructive or creative in addressing the posted issue. I ask again. If an improvment is made what have you lost? Nobodies demanding anything here. I'm just highlighting an issue. I'm new to RW but have been around simulators since the Amiga 500.

If you're happy with it and don't have any constructive input to help with the problem ...why post? Doing so turns each issue into a poll! like it or not MSTS developed because folk rolled up their sleeves and worked on fixes or hacks to enable many issues that were raised. Like it or not UKTS would probably have died with MSTS years ago if that hadn't happened.

We all have our own interaction with any simulation. In Flight Simulation you can buy virtual airliners that take as much time to preflight and start as the real thing. Obviously a huge learning curve and a huge consumer of your time.... BUT! Some folk just love that ...so why wouldn't you encourage the facility. You DON'T have to buy those models.

Posting that you can still see it if you press F4 does not answer the problem does it? That's not a personal snipe at the poster. But IMHO it illustrates all too clearly a too often found trend on the RW forums that the poster has not read or not considered fully the issue raised by the originator of the thread.

Identifying a problem and posting in the forum does not make anyone a troll. Ridiculing the issue probably does IMO.

Geoff

[styckx]

Two people replied that what you asked can be done. You skipped over those posts, never addressing it. So.. Are we done here now that you know it can be done or would you like step by step instructions?

[lateagain]

Two people replied that what you asked can be done. You skipped over those posts, never addressing it. So.. Are we done here now that you know it can be done or would you like step by step instructions?

Well that might be helpful to a few folk don't you think? However as it's also been identified that this is a change from previous versions (I have only the posts to go on) and that it apparently affects all but a third party add-on maybe a more fundamental fix for all stock is what is needed. I'm happy to modify bits of code but many have neither the experience or confidence to do that. I didn't skip over anything. It takes time to post more than a one liner and word it so that it isn't immediately turned into fuel for a non existant fire .

[hertsbob]

http://forums.uktrainsim.com/viewtopic. ... 4&t=110597

Cheers

Bob

(There still won't be any action from RSC about it, but it would appear to be the official UKTS thread for such things. Me - I never get round to driving anything anyway. What's this alerter sound all about then? Isn't that what the signal arms are for? )

[styckx]

@lateagain

I will take that as a no and the filler in between is of no use to me. So on that note good luck with your aws troubles. My time in this thread (checks watch) is up.

[FoggyMorning]

Snipe away I've been sniped at by experts.... but the fact remains that there is an issue here that as has been suggested is fixable? Fixing ALL the stock this applies to would probably best be done by Steam?

Why shouldn't folk discuss other simulators? We're discussing software here and Simulation is a long established sector of software. Simulation was being programmed before anyone had ever dreamt of "Personal Computers" and as each generation of Simulator has evolved each has sought to bring more facilities on board. Frankly the "Footie Fan" "My simulator is better than your Simulator" attitude will get you nowhere fast. Simulation on PC's has developed because folk with some creative analysis, if not the no-how to answer their own questions, have asked Why can't it do this? and wouldn't it be good if we can make it do that! If Ford and Volswagen make Air Con standard on all their cars where do you suppose General Motors Sales would be if they listened to all who said "You don't need that..."

The software is NOT a holy grail! It is, or rather it SHOULD be, a "work in progress".

IMHO far too often on the RW forums there has been a negative attitude to any suggestion that there is a problem or that this or that could be improved. Do you think Microsoft could have sold X versions of Office if they'd adopted such an attitude to feedback? Of course they couldn't.

All too often any issue raised here is greeted by dozens of posts saying stuff along the lines of "I'm happy with it..." or "I don't see the problem..." both responses being neither constructive or creative in addressing the posted issue. I ask again. If an improvment is made what have you lost? Nobodies demanding anything here. I'm just highlighting an issue. I'm new to RW but have been around simulators since the Amiga 500.

If you're happy with it and don't have any constructive input to help with the problem ...why post? Doing so turns each issue into a poll! like it or not MSTS developed because folk rolled up their sleeves and worked on fixes or hacks to enable many issues that were raised. Like it or not UKTS would probably have died with MSTS years ago if that hadn't happened.

We all have our own interaction with any simulation. In Flight Simulation you can buy virtual airliners that take as much time to preflight and start as the real thing. Obviously a huge learning curve and a huge consumer of your time.... BUT! Some folk just love that ...so why wouldn't you encourage the facility. You DON'T have to buy those models.

Posting that you can still see it if you press F4 does not answer the problem does it? That's not a personal snipe at the poster. But IMHO it illustrates all too clearly a too often found trend on the RW forums that the poster has not read or not considered fully the issue raised by the originator of the thread.

Identifying a problem and posting in the forum does not make anyone a troll. Ridiculing the issue probably does IMO.

Geoff

For what it's worth, and at the risk of repeating myself, my initial post was not intended as a "I don't see anything wrong with it" type post. I'll admit the flippancy probably didn't help but you'll have to put it down to a character flaw I'm afraid.

The stated issue was that there is no longer a visual indicator of AWS warnings; my response was that there is if you enable the F4 display. I would like to think that that just about falls in to the category of a constructive comment.

Steve

[lateagain]

What's this alerter sound all about then? Isn't that what the signal arms are for? )

so true but I like to be open minded and drive some modern stuff every now and then. That being comparitively dull, compared to nursing a kettle, one finds oneself gazing at the landscape ....only to find the !*@%£% emergency brakes have applied whilst one was admirin' the trees

Seriously all credit to making the AWS work but if you HAVE to drive in cab you might as well have BVE?

Thanks for the link but I would point out (to others reading) that as I'm new to using RW (but with experience of many other simulators) I didn't know if this was juts my problem when I posted. That's the whole point of forums ....or it used to be

[hertsbob]

Forgot to mention that when I do get around to driving, it's invariably goods traffic and I rarely exceed 25mph. I've heard it said all sorts of strange things happen to the body at such an unnatural velocity, so I daren't go any faster than that!

(Don't worry - I'll fall asleep soon)

Cheers

Bob

[AndiS]

Myself, I hope that the alerter symbols (scorned traffic signs where they were there) will be optional when and if they reappear.

I must also say that there are a few things which cover the ground more or less. But certainly there are still gaps between these features:

• Sound is something generated inside the cab. It is prototypical not to hear it outside.
• Simple controls are there for those who want to play it simple. AWS confirmation is not required when using simple controls. Unfortunately, some engines only work in expert mode.
• You see signals coming in 3D view. If you don't, I must say that flying that far from the engine while driving is bound to give you trouble anyway.
• You also see signals coming in F4 display, unless you turn it off, of course.
• From the location of the signal, you can guess the location of the AWS. Unfortunately, it is not always placed at the same distance form the signal, which is ok. Anyway, it is yellow, so unless you fly quite high, you might see it.
• Pressing Q too often does not hurt. So hammering it whenever you pass a signal cannot be wrong. But you need to learn the aspect it shows anyway, so I am not so sure what the benefit of not looking there would be.

Independent of the specific issue, I can assure you, Geoff, that all features of BVE, MSTS, Trainz and Zusi have been lectured to RSC and the general public for years. RSC stopped reading here long ago because it got a bit repetitive and emotional and also they have this great email management system where they can transfer all input to their big wishlist database. Therefore, the current approach is to send all suggestions by email and focus on working on what we have and what we can change ourselves. This just to ensure that emotions stay at acceptable levels.

[Esurient]

Personally, I'm not too fussed if it comes back or not. If i'm playing a career scenario, i'll stick to the cab but if it's a standard one, i'll either keep F3 or F4 open if i'm flying around out the cab. If it does come back, I'd much prefer the triangle warning rather than the sound.

[Retro]

I found the Triangle very useful when I was testing my Route using the outside view. The F4 HUD takes up to much of the screen IMHO. I did email Support about these issues and quite a few others. Presumably it could be put back when using the F3 or F5 Displays as these turn off when you enter the new F4 HUD.
Kind regards James.

[lateagain]

@lateagain

I will take that as a no and the filler in between is of no use to me. So on that note good luck with your aws troubles. My time in this thread (checks watch) is up.

Got a First name styckx? More friendly don't you think?

Sorry to ignore your post but I got bogged down in the other thread. Hopefully this will be more constructive. Of course I'm interested in a fix and so are others? If you can post one here I'm sure we'd love to have a crack.

Just one point though you mention that the fix is loco specific? I'm now reading about the Triangle(?) alerter that used to be there before the RW2 upgrade? I haven't had any earlier version than RW2 so I stand to be corrected? It occurs to me that if a programmed event can trigger a graphic pop-up it could also trigger a sound?

Curently I've not delved into any RS scripts so any advise and step by step guidance is welcome.

Cheers

Geoff

[ghawk2005]

i really don't understand sometimes. Here we have a community that moaned about not having an alerter in external view, so the developers put what i thought was a very useful large warning triangle for when the AWS alerter was going off, not 100% realistic i know, but with games there have to be some compromises. Then people moaned and it was removed. Surely the best solution is to make it an "option" to have it on or off in the game settings rather than to remove it all together, that way it keeps everyone happy. I have looked and can find no option to replace it, please correct me if there is such an option.

I for one would certainly vote the alerter sound or warning triangle in the external view and would make life a bit easier when doing 125 down the line and not having the brakes applied because you took a few seconds to view the train from outside etc.

[lateagain]

i really don't understand sometimes. Here we have a community that moaned about not having an alerter in external view, so the developers put what i thought was a very useful large warning triangle for when the AWS alerter was going off, not 100% realistic i know, but with games there have to be some compromises. Then people moaned and it was removed. Surely the best solution is to make it an "option" to have it on or off in the game settings rather than to remove it all together, that way it keeps everyone happy. I have looked and can find no option to replace it, please correct me if there is such an option.

I for one would certainly vote the alerter sound or warning triangle in the external view and would make life a bit easier when doing 125 down the line and not having the brakes applied because you took a few seconds to view the train from outside etc.

When I started this thread I hadn't realised that there was a history to this. Perhaps too many "Fans" have assumed that all users are "day one users" with a full knowledge of the Sims development History? I'm sure I'm not alone in being unaware of the triangle until it was mentioned in this thread. ghawk2005 (got a first name much friendlier?) my reason for posting is understood by a good few posters here and I'd be willing to bet they'd all welcome either a sound OR a return to the graphic?

geoff