DT's 2P and Fish Vans coming to Steam

[pilot37]

I have the original version which is a pretty low quality model and not what is on sale here. There are now some high res shots on DT's site....much better.

[pilot37]

I do love all the folk coming to the defense of the steam website info....comments made by folk who clearly haven't bought yet either

[transadelaide]

I do love all the folk coming to the defense of the steam website info....comments made by folk who clearly haven't bought yet either

-1

I don't see anybody making any ill-informed remarks in defence of Steam on here. This all relates to DT's non-committal and ambiguous remarks, which unfortunately is a direct result of over-zealous criticism on places like UKTS when things don't quite go to plan.

[pilot37]

My point was a slightly different one. The P2 is sold on steam as an add-on to Railworks. It is not sold as an upgrade of an older DT product. Low res pictures, no pictures of the cab, only one livery shown, no sound recording or video. Why sell it so poorly? Why should I assume it is the same cab as before when everything else has been improved?

Going by the 4MT, DT products are very high quality. I just don't understand why Railworks add-ons are put up for sale with so little information, especially when there is a no returns policy.

[pilot37]

Anybody bought it? Any reviews?

[USRailFan]

Bought it, but haven't really ran it much... Quality looks very good to me. But the scenarios suffer from the same silly fault that many other steam era scenarios do: Some of the steam-hauled freight trains do not have brake vans...

[pdeee]

Bought it, but haven't really ran it much... Quality looks very good to me. But the scenarios suffer from the same silly fault that many other steam era scenarios do: Some of the steam-hauled freight trains do not have brake vans...

It is much more difficult to create a goods train scenario, where there is shunting required and also have a brake van attached, so the easy thing is to not include a brake van, not very realistic I admit, also RW's Scenario Editor does not make it very easy to do this operation, at more than one station. Personally still waiting on DT to make their package available.

[crumplezone]

Going to drop a review once I see what DT releases for existing purchases, don't feel like buying it twice, once its up I'll pop a review up and some decent screenshots from Railworks. Though I have to say from the screenshots knocking about it does look decidingly upgraded model and paintjob wise.

[USRailFan]

Bought it, but haven't really ran it much... Quality looks very good to me. But the scenarios suffer from the same silly fault that many other steam era scenarios do: Some of the steam-hauled freight trains do not have brake vans...

It is much more difficult to create a goods train scenario, where there is shunting required and also have a brake van attached, so the easy thing is to not include a brake van, not very realistic I admit, also RW's Scenario Editor does not make it very easy to do this operation, at more than one station. Personally still waiting on DT to make their package available.

That's a point, of course. Now, I only ran the scenario for five minutes or so, the train I noticed without a brakevan seemed to me to be a mainline train, with two doubleheaded steamers (Black 5s) and a long string of tankers (milk cars)

[black8]

..... the train I noticed without a brakevan seemed to me to be a mainline train, with two doubleheaded steamers (Black 5s) and a long string of tankers (milk cars)

I know what you mean, however in the case of the milktrain, I believe these tankers were not classified as freight stock and were equipped for fast running, therefore allowed to be attached to express passenger trains when needed, much the same as the Blue Spot fishvans (correct me if I am wrong here). Having said that I am not so sure if milktrains required a brakevan at all . But yes, it would be nice if more attention to detail was given to (BR) trains in RW(2) and get rid of attaching LMS or SR branded brakevans to freight trains well into the BR era and full 'blood and custard' coaching stock trains to late crest steamlocos and even Diesels (not in a preserved 'railtour' scenario), or vice versa early crest steamlocos to full maroon coaching stock trains. Fortunately the private (i.e. non-commercial) scenario builders appear to pay more attention to this and with RW Tools a lot can be 'corrected' by ourselves.
Cheers
Jos

[Oldpufferspotter]

Hi,
In the 1950s I used to see the overnight Carlisle Cricklewood milk train come through while I was on night shift. It was composed of all 6-wheel milk tankers together with a BR standard vacuum brake fitted goods brake van. The brake van had tankers in front and behind it.
A six-wheeled passenger full brake would also be used on milk only trains as well, but the Carlisle Cricklewood always had a vacuum fitted goods brake van in my experience.
regards Ted.

[longbow]

As you say, steam-era scenarios sometimes get basic things wrong (cue plug for my recent Steam Era Scenario guide, available now from this very website!)

Milk tanks were usually conveyed in passenger trains or dedicated milk trains and not in goods trains, and until 1968 a brake vehicle would be required to convey the guard, usually in a passenger brake.

[holzroller]

Until sometime in the 70's all trains required a brake van iirc. At some point in the 70's guards were allowed to ride in the rear cab of the loco on fully fitted freight trains, passenger, unfitted and trains hauled by a single cab loco still required a brake van. For certain short distance trip workings local instructions allowed the use of single cab locos on fully fitted trains without a brake van. An exception also was when certain dangerous goods were conveyed a brake was still required.

[holzroller]

Until sometime in the 70's all trains required a brake van. At some point in the 70's guards were allowed to ride in the rear cab of the loco on fully fitted freight trains. Passenger, unfitted and trains hauled by a single cab loco still required a brake van. For certain short distance trip workings local instructions allowed the use of single cab locos on fully fitted trains without a brake van.

[pdeee]

As you say, steam-era scenarios sometimes get basic things wrong (cue plug for my recent Steam Era Scenario guide, available now from this very website!)

Milk tanks were usually conveyed in passenger trains or dedicated milk trains and not in goods trains, and until 1968 a brake vehicle would be required to convey the guard, usually in a passenger brake.

The Guide is well worth reading, lots of valuable information on this subject.