Does the Dispatcher Learn ?

[Acorncomputer]

Hi all

I am writing a few scenarios for the RailWorks version of The Big Layout. I note that although the paths successfully show up as red in the new scenario editor, when you run the scenario the paths often stop at junctions (even auto junctions) and you manually have to set the points on the 2D map which then shows the blue line to another set of points. I do not particularly mind much that the player has to keep checking the points ahead as it something to keep alert about and part of the scenario experience.

I have noticed, though, that after a couple of test runs, the blue line does not always stop at points where it did before and initially shows much further down the line than originally. I have noticed this before in other scenarios and it seems to indicate that the dispatcher is learning from the past runs.

It is a bit weird, but is it possible that the Dispatcher is using some intelligence of its own ?

[davveb]

Be afraid, it's becoming sentient! -
"Open the pod bay doors please HAL"
"I'm sorry Dave, I can't do that"

Seriously, I don't know about learning between sessions, but the dispatcher is not quite the numbskull some make it out to be. It's facinating to run a scenario containing interacting trains with the pathing logging enabled. You can see the dispatcher "searching" for a valid through path for each train, recalculating each time a train passes a track node (little red triangles) until it finally works out a way to get every train to it's destination. Of course, it still makes mistakes, just like any fallible human being - so maybe it is alive!

Dave B

[AndiS]

My guess would be that you went into edit mode once, or scenario edit. In one of the two, it saves the switch position. I can't say which one, but in one of the two cases, it definitely saves the current switch position, which is a great thing. However, if you are not aware of it, you will be surprised. Like me, not thinking much about it in my testing, but from time to time, the starting positions are changed. If you repeat the last action, then generally you will appreciate the new saved state and feel the game learnt something.

Just my guess.

[GavNormandale]

hi, i think it most likely that your train has arrived at a point at a different time to before, other trains in the area at a certain time may affect the junctions in your scenarios

Gav

[Acorncomputer]

Hi

I have been experimenting a bit and this is how I see it -

The new scenario editor makes it easy to build up a set of instructions for consists and reliably shows the paths in red on the half view of the 2D map - very good.

What the editor does not seem to do is pass the pathing information on to the Dispatcher so that he can set the points to match the path plotted by the scenario editor. You might say that the dispatcher is waiting for the scenario to run before deciding if you can go along the path set by the editor but this is not valid as the Dispatcher does not change points at any time during the running of the scenario to match the editor path and in some cases has simply followed the default setting of the points as they were when the new scenario was originally created from the base free roam scenario.

As AndiS suggested, the partial solution seems to be to set the points manually in the scenario so that they match the path plotted by the scenario editor. This is not as straightforward as it sounds but this sequence of actions seems to work in setting the points and then getting the changes to be remembered when the scenario editor mode is closed.

a) Run the scenario
b) When the scenario has started, enter the Scenario Editor mode (not the World Editor mode)
c) Fly round the path of your scenario physically viewing the state of the points.
d) If you find a set of points that is routing in the wrong direction, pull up the 2D map (key 9 or icon in bottom pop up window), find the points on your map, Shift + Click on the blue circle which will change the points direction, click on the clock icon (the new scenario editor link), click on OK in the new scenario editor which will then take you back to the track view and you will see that the points have changed.
e) Carry out the same procedure for each incorrectly set of points.
f) When all changes have been made, press F2 to save changes and then exit the scenario editor mode by clicking on the big orange arrow.

When you run the scenario again, the changes you have made to the points should have been remembered.
I have noted that changing points in a scenario like this does not change those points in other scenarios so the changes are unique to that particular scenario.

Instead of flying around the route in scenario mode to find incorrectly set points, it is possible to identify them from the (key 9) 2D map. The direction of the points setting is indicated by a dark grey line so you could probably change and save the changes all from the 2D map.

There is still a bit more experimenting to do but knowing these small techniques is very helpful in achieving the results you are looking for.

[paulz6]

Does the Dispatcher Learn ?
Probably not. Is there any true AI behind the dispatcher?

Does the scenario creator learn?
Probably. A human gets some kind of inkling behind what the software is doing through experience.

There seems to be two aspects with scenario's.
1.) There seems to be an initial calculative set of conditions as to whether a scenario is valid.
2.) The run-time environment seems to react to events depending on how the scenario progresses.

I am not sure there is a dispatcher as such (I think it is a phrase the community has coined), but I am almost certain that there is no AI and just a set of procedures.

[Acorncomputer]

Hi all

I am a bit baffled as no matter what I do, I cannot create a scenario where the dispatcher sets all of the points for the player train even though he clearly knows what the correct path is. Even when the points are set manually in the scenario editor, (as described above) the settings are temporarily remembered but then when the scenario is run again another day, the same sets of points revert back to their incorrect settings. This does not prevent the scenario from being completed successfully as the player can keep looking ahead and manually change the points. There is no problem at all with this and it also introduces an element of work for the player to keep the scenario moving.

The feeling is that the dispatcher should be setting the points and if it is not, then there is something wrong. I am now ignoring this quirk of the game and just keep leaving messages for the player to check the points regularly and if they do, then they will achieve a successful completion of the scenario with all green ticks.

I am wondering if other people who complain of being stopped at red signals that will not change are not looking at their 2D maps and simply manually changing the points.

One annoying feature I am experiencing is that RW is not defaulting to showing the icons I select in the 2D map. On entering the 2D map in play or edit mode, I am having to select each time the icons to show on the map. In particular the player blue path is not showing up by default when running a scenario and has to be turned on each time using the monitor icon to access the selection screen. How can I get it to remember my settings.

[Trainguy76]

One annoying feature I am experiencing is that RW is not defaulting to showing the icons I select in the 2D map. On entering the 2D map in play or edit mode, I am having to select each time the icons to show on the map. In particular the player blue path is not showing up by default when running a scenario and has to be turned on each time using the monitor icon to access the selection screen. How can I get it to remember my settings.

This was happening to me until yesterday actually. I some how had changed the settings back and saved, and it 'remembered'. Strange, as I wasn't expecting that.

[FoggyMorning]

Just a thought, and possibly a very wayward one since I'm still taking baby steps in scenario creation, but do you have "handle off path" enabled?

[OrpheusRocker]

One annoying feature I am experiencing is that RW is not defaulting to showing the icons I select in the 2D map. On entering the 2D map in play or edit mode, I am having to select each time the icons to show on the map. In particular the player blue path is not showing up by default when running a scenario and has to be turned on each time using the monitor icon to access the selection screen. How can I get it to remember my settings.

You might want to look at this thread for your display options issue.
http://forums.uktrainsim.com/viewtopic. ... 4&t=103375
Andy

[Acorncomputer]

Hi Andy

Thanks for that link. I will try it out tonight and see if that does the trick.

I will also play around a bit with the 'handle off path' and 'allow reversing' instructions to see what differences this makes to the running of the scenario. On reflection, it is only some junctions where the points are set incorrectly. Perhaps the dispatcher is actually inviting the player to go a different way if they choose.

[Acorncomputer]

Hi

After having spent a long time working on five scenarios for the Railworks version of The Big Layout and testing each scenario, I decided that I would give them all another check after the recent 'German' update. I found that two of them had been corrupted for unknown reasons.

One had the destination changed to something completely different to the pre-update destination and no matter what I did, any changes I made to the destination would not be saved. The couple of instructions before the destination had also disappeared and these could not be re-instated. The only way I could repair this scenario was to re-name the siding marker at the intended destination and then the changes saved. The marker I wanted to end at and the marker that the dispatcher wanted to end at were different names completely so there could have been no confusion.

I found in another scenario that the player train could no longer complete its path, even though I had tested several time before without problem. The dispatcher told me that another service was blocking the way. I eventually found that where I had previously changed a marker with the same name as another, the update seems to have re-instated the changed marker so I now had two of the same name again. After making a few more changes I eventually got the scenario to run properly again.

Despite the advice given earlier in this thread, I still cannot get the dispatcher to automatically set all of the points correctly on a player path in a scenario. Although the dispatcher clearly does know the correct path, there always seems to be one or two points that have to manually set in order to reveal the blue line even though there is no AI traffic crossing the path. I can live with this and it makes the scenario more interesting to play, but it seems to indicate that something is not quite right.