Atomic Systems

I had a thought today (dangerous at my age ).

1. The problem - Many routes being released these days require a huge number of freeware assets which the downloader may/may not have. Even if the Assets are in the uktrainsim file library, the download effort involved can be quite large, especially for those with poor internet links.

2. The solution - Collect all of the RailSimulator and RailWorks assets together and have uktrainsim publish them on a DVD at a reasonable price. Users could then install those items required with no downloading being required and this would also give route authors a much greater pool of assets to use which they would know a large percentage of users would have.

I feel this would be much more use to the community than Uktrainsim publishing routes on disks for RailWorks as the base routes are actually quite small and easily downloaded, it is the mass of assets which take up the downloading time, especially as the texture files for assets can be huge.

This is just a suggestion to provoke thought and I wonder how it would be received? No doubt there will be some asset author out there who comes up with the 'No way they can publish my assets on their disks'. Well if those sort of authors are still around, I would suggest they take their toys home now before they cause any problems, we had enough of that attitude with the other simulator.

Mike

Hi Mike,
You have got it right, that is a super idea, I agree with your every word, 1 DVD for RW and another for MSTS so that they are not mixed up
that is assets only for 1 RW will not be mixed in with MSTS assets, or would that pose a problem, are RW assets stored in the same place as MSTS assets.

As you say it can be a nightmare working with a load of assets. I cant think of any problems with your suggestion.
UKTS, I'll be the first (or not far from it) to order a DVD with all the assets on it.

I've just spent a week trying to track down a Class 158 for a scenario that would not accept the item that the scenario requested.
I eventually found 3, the second one I tried was the fix.
If I had the DVD I'd have had it fixed in a few minutes.

With that route that has the huge load of assets and the problems I'd guess that there are members who are not downloading or using
it due to the problems. Again a DVD would solve most of its assets.

Hi Mike

One pitfall, having to keep the DVD up to date with the latest assets. For routes I think all required assets should be included within the package . I'm new to Railworks and assume this is possible. It should be a proviso that all assets uploaded to UKTrainsim can be freely distributed with a freeware route.

Gordon

Hi all
What a good idea.
The only problem I can see is the disc will require up-dating every couple of months as more assets are uploaded to UKTS, however I'm sure that can be overcome.
Having said that, I will be one of the first to buy the disc.
Regards to all
Alan

Yes Gordon, but they wont do that.
however you remembered me about this, a super route is "under construction" and the programmer has the assets required in
3 assets only folders, at this moment there are 3 to keep the size of each one not too large, they average out at about 30mb each.
Of course as he progresses he uses more assets and he will then make another asset file.
That is the way to to it and when you get the route ALL the correct items will be with it.
That is the best solution provided all programmers include the assets and not just one or two.
The programmers have the assets so why cant they package them like that.

When this route comes out it will be up there with the very best and maybe better.

This is also being discussed on this thread:

http://forums.uktrainsim.com/viewtopic. ... 0#p1239551

I think an option so that we know which assets on UKTS are licensed under a GPL type license (free for all to use as they wish). Then they can be packaged as part of the route but it is important that the route author modifies 3rd party assets so that they are part of the route folder structure and not the original asset folder structure.

Otherwise conflicts will arise with different routes overwriting the same 3rd party assets with possibly different versions.

Jim

I agree with Gordon, we should find a situation where any assets used can be packaged with a route, keeping a freeware route completely free and not having a need to "subscribe" to an updated dvd with assets, a solution which could also be a logistical nightmare.

dipper6 wrote:Yes Gordon, but they wont do that.

I don't see why we cannot come to some sort of happy medium with it. After all, probably 99% of authors provide freeware because they wan't it to be enjoyed as just that. If there are those that are not willing to allow assets to be incuded in a route package, what are the chances of them allowing their assets to be put on a dvd which is essentially for sale? While the idea does have merits, it is kind of turning freeware into payware, no matter how much the fee and that could be a huge put off for some new users, something we don't want.

If an author does provide assets to download as freeware, we need to establish that they can be used in a route package. If there are assets that authors dont want included, we need to know why and if so, maybe other freeware creators can build suitable alternatives that can be included. Otherwise, we are going to end up with a situation where 99% of routes are going to contain default items only, certainly achieveable after the success of the RBC but routes of the like of W & B are never going to happen again after the initial problems that were encountered (thankfully solved) as it is going to be a huge put off.

Hi all,
I think it is a very good idea to issue a DVD, and I wouldn't worry about updates for the DVD either. A new or updated DVD could be released every six months or so.
I always make a copy onto CD or DVD of any assets I download as it is, in case I need to reinstall any of them for any reason.
It would be great to buy a DVD with all the released freeware on it, not only as an extra backup of what I already have, but also of any that I might want to 'go back' and retrieve should I buy a loco, say, and want to retrieve re-skins for it, etc.
regards Ted.

Maybe RW should have a look at the Trainz system
Give every assets a unique number that's the same everywhere
Maybe make a central downloadsystem, or at least an index where people can download the assets (also sites beside UKTS)

Then problem with a DVD is that you can't easily update it, maybe we can use a downloadservice like mediafire for assets packs


Jaap

jaapsloot wrote:Maybe RW should have a look at the Trainz system
Give every assets a unique number that's the same everywhere
Maybe make a central downloadsystem, or at least an index where people can download the assets (also sites beside UKTS)

Then problem with a DVD is that you can't easily update it, maybe we can use a downloadservice like mediafire for assets packs


Jaap

I think the horse has bolted on this. It is sort of funny though but before Rail Simulator came out this was all discussed on this forum and the one thing that came out out it was that users did not want a centralized download system like Trainz, how times change.

John

This has popped up a few times before, about a RW system similar to the Trainz system yet people seem to be of the idea that RS.com need to be responsible for it. What have they got to gain from doing it? Especially on top of everything else that is requested from them.

The discussion has stemmed from whether freeware developers would allow their assets to be included with Shane's route and as far as I could see, hardly any came forward. We need to know the reason for this because where does the problem lie? By including all assets needed with a route does this then step on the toes of UKTS because less premium membership would be needed to collate all the files that people need? I dont think so, simply because people will be more likely to pay for premium access to download a route package and assets in excess of 200mb.

This again brings me to the replies above. Many have replied so far to say that a dvd is an excellent idea, something they will pay for and that is fair enough but do you honestly believe that all developers will allow their assets to be used on the dvd? After all, it is re-distribution in the same way as if the assets are included with a route.

Finally, if all assets are included with a route (tested and working of course) then it will only show up as one item in the Package Manager list. Doing it from dvd means you then have to find the assets you want from a huge list, and then install them separately resulting in a huge Package Manager list. Of course, a new feature is coming where multiple assets can be installed at once but which is easier?

Essentially using a DVD or download site you still have the hassle of installing the assets ( unless you use something along Steam lines), that's why I prefer the simple solution (if you have a broadband connection) of including them in the route.

Gordon

P.S. posted before I had read the previous post by Darpor

jaapsloot wrote:Maybe RW should have a look at the Trainz system
Give every assets a unique number that's the same everywhere
Maybe make a central downloadsystem, or at least an index where people can download the assets (also sites beside UKTS)

Then problem with a DVD is that you can't easily update it, maybe we can use a downloadservice like mediafire for assets packs


Jaap

Yes Jaap but please one that's not so complicated.
Plus it is a slow as hel. (Trainz is he)

CaptScarlet wrote:

jaapsloot wrote:Maybe RW should have a look at the Trainz system
Give every assets a unique number that's the same everywhere
Maybe make a central downloadsystem, or at least an index where people can download the assets (also sites beside UKTS)

Then problem with a DVD is that you can't easily update it, maybe we can use a downloadservice like mediafire for assets packs


Jaap

I think the horse has bolted on this. It is sort of funny though but before Rail Simulator came out this was all discussed on this forum and the one thing that came out out it was that users did not want a centralized download system like Trainz, how times change.

John

It' s as normal as can be.
We need a download center that works he.
The downnload center in Trainz is for most users pita

I don't agree with this, why should we pay for DVD's of FREEware assets when we are already paying for a premium subscription? As has been suggested, asset creators should come forward and allow route builders to include their assets with the route, as long as it remains freeware and due credit is given.