Minimalistic Long Routes

[msey0002]

I don't think it would be great swathes of greenery though, I think Vern meant minimal scenery in the way Thomson Interactive do it, and they do it very well

[darkdj]

If theres a new minimalistic scenery route in progress, id me more than happy to contribute in one way or another, if possible.

Though I personally like short, high detail routes, a longer route with better loading would certainly be welcome! Especially for a good long thrash up and around and down and all over the place!

[bigvern]

There's certainly degrees of minimal and my mindset for this experiment is the sort of thing you could expect to see in OpenBVE. i.e. The infrastructure pretty much intact but detailed mapping of towns, housing estates replaced by more generic placement. The block assets should be a help in this respect, at least in the flatter areas. At the moment I'm looking at around a month to lay the track, two months for the scenery placement and a month to put in all the signalling and interactives plus an undetermined time for testing. Assuming the thing gets from Euston to Glasgow, that's 5 hours driving one way on the old Class 87 hauled Royal Scot timings!

[Phil160]

one thing that could be taken into consideration is the average speed of the trains using the route.
take the hope valley for example, it was built for goods, passenger services made up less than a quarter of 103 movements in a 24 hour period, with trains traveling on average between 15-25mph up until the end of steam . i would include more scenery if i was build it in this era because you would get more time to look around. compare that to you speeding through on a modern version between 75-100mph where you would notice less due to the higher speed.
with a lower average speed you can also keep the short as well, and still get reasonably long activities. i do think though that a slow 30mph goods from London all the way to glasgow would get a bit boring after a bit regardless of how much scenery is in the route.
Phil t

[bigvern]

Looking at the poll and my own thoughts after a couple of days doing some rudimentary track laying, I have concluded that it is probably not the best approach to a RW route. (I did say it was an experiment). It dawned on me while laying out a simplified Carnforth, that this type of approach is going to be barely credible at locations like Crewe, or Willesden.

Certainly trying it with the whole WCML was a mistake and as others pointed out it seems a bit stupid duplicating - in an inferior form - a route of which 25% already exists in the game (and may well feature in RSC future plans for an extension). Better to look at a shorter route with simpler infrastructure for trial purposes.

I still think there is merit in looking to see where time savings can be made in the route building process, but in (say) 3 to 4 months it ought to be possible to produce a medium level detail version of something like the Cambrian Coast (still one of my favoutite projects from MSTS) or the West Highland Mallaig extension which still give users a two hour drive in each direction.

[d1023]

Hi, whilst I'm no route builder (time and skills let me down) I thought that the idea in this thread was a sound one.
That said it's clear that RW3 has come significant challenges when it comes to bigger routes. WCML North is in my opinion the best yet in terms of length and the fact that at the Glasgow end there is a network of routes means it's not just a point to point line like the defualt routes.
I;m glad to see I'm not the only one fed up with running trains from Oxford to Reading!

If a RW3 equivilant of Thames Mersey, Dorset Coast etc is unlikely then it seems that three or four self contained but connected routes is the next best option.
So running south from WCML North you could try Gretna Junction - Preston, North West Network (Preston - Stafford, with Liverpool and Manchester links Warrington, Chester et al), Midlands (Rugby - Stafford via both Brumland and the Trent Valley) WCML South (Rugby-Euston, incl Bedford, Northampton, Watford DC).
The question is if route builders would share assets and track plans with each other - why rebuild Carlisle when its already there?
Some of these are already in progress but it seems that some joined up thinking would leave the RW3 world with a better end result
Lots of thoughts, some impractical (probably), some of interest (deffinitly)

Now to slip the Creative Rail team a fiver to plan down to Kings Cross!!!!

Regards.

[Darpor]

The question is if route builders would share assets and track plans with each other - why rebuild Carlisle when its already there?

The main issue being, why would payware developers want to share their assets with freeware projects? It may be that they have their own extensions/new routes planned for these assets in the future and would therefore rightly protect them.

I know what I would like the answer to be though, I would share everything at the drop of a hat if it gave enough of a benefit. I still don't go along with the whole idea of all routes needing to be joined though, I have always maintained that as long as routes end at a suitable location that would normally provide dwell time in real life, then you can just load up the next part of the scenario that has been created on the next route and continue onwards. This all helps with route optimization as well.

[bigvern]

Another reason for dropping the WCML idea apart from the fact who knows if Keith is beavering away on Preston to Carlisle, is that I believe someone was working on the Trent Valley section.

People may moan about the lack of UK routes but in truth we are quite well served and it is becoming increasingly difficult - without looking at obscure closed lines or remote branches - to find a study which does not encroach on something that's already been done.

[nobkins]

it is becoming increasingly difficult - without looking at obscure closed lines or remote branches - to find a study which does not encroach on something that's already been done.

True indeed. However, if it is a line that interests the route builder or they wish to model it in a different era etc then I think doing the same line as someone else is still a lot of fun. Even if people do the same thing I think there is no harm in it. Would be better if they teamed up but not everyone wants to do that

Jim

[d1023]

Another reason for dropping the WCML idea apart from the fact who knows if Keith is beavering away on Preston to Carlisle, is that I believe someone was working on the Trent Valley section.

People may moan about the lack of UK routes but in truth we are quite well served and it is becoming increasingly difficult - without looking at obscure closed lines or remote branches - to find a study which does not encroach on something that's already been done.

Does that mean that Keith is or is not doing Preston - Carlisle?
There was someone doing the Midlands bit and WCML South but I'm not sure how far they have got.

There is still lots still that no one has done with "extensions" to existing lines an obvious start.

Plymouth - Exeter.
Exeter - Salisbury - (Waterloo)
Oxford - Birmingham.
Newcastle - Edinburgh.
York - Leeds/Doncaster.
etc etc

There is also the whole of the Southern to be done with the Pompey line being the exception.

[bigvern]

Does that mean that Keith is or is not doing Preston - Carlisle?

Pure speculation on my part, but it would be the logical next stage.

[nobkins]

York - Leeds/Doncaster.

TPR has all that covered in the modern era at least.

[Darpor]

Newcastle - Edinburgh.

Thats a good one......

[FoggyMorning]

Oxford to Birmingham seems like a bit of a weird one. Not sure what that would add really

[crowman]

There was someone doing the Midlands bit and WCML South but I'm not sure how far they have got.

That will be me

I'm about 15 miles north of Milton Keynes heading South. Building through country side at the moment so the track has trees both sides, so no need for much distant scenery.

Still taking a long time to build. To be honest my plan to build London Euston to Liverpool Lime is a bit ambitious, at the time I had no idea route building would take so long, and the start of the route was already done for me by jetgriff.

Still plodding along though, slowly

Paul