Superb news. I have no plans to increase the premium sub, never have.
For an additional clarification, does this apply to scenery within routes only, or does it also include stock packs (e.g. if a route were to be made available as a download along with a stock pack that contains some of Terry's loco's etc). I'm specifically thinking about Highworth in that instance but i've also had the question asked regarding others too.
Please forward my thanks to Terry, for what they're worth!
Regards
Matt.
Announcement re: commercial pre-release screenshots rule
Moderator: Moderators
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johndibben
- Bletchley Park:home of first programmable computer
- Posts: 14007
- Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2001 12:00 am
- Location: Bletchley
Late arriving at the party. We've been saying that for days.basildd wrote:I can see this going round and round in circles and just as it starts to settle, along you or someone else will come and pour on a little more petrol, just so that the whole thing flares up again.
The secrecy surrounding The Association, events, individuals and the way it was disclosed made it an issue.
OK, there's no connection. We're all happy.
Sounds like there's some good news.
Too busy to read, yet analyse it all and will leave that to those involved and comment when it's clear.
Cheers
John
It'll be short for me... 
Thanks for the detailed explanation Dale, it might have helped earlier.
Thanks for the Permissions Terry, I'd have hated to loose your work.
I think the association site as proposed is an excellent idea and hope that links will be maintained with UKTS.
If I've bored anyone or gone over the top....
"The opposite of love is not hate.....it's indifference"
Geoff
Thanks for the detailed explanation Dale, it might have helped earlier.
Thanks for the Permissions Terry, I'd have hated to loose your work.
I think the association site as proposed is an excellent idea and hope that links will be maintained with UKTS.
If I've bored anyone or gone over the top....
"The opposite of love is not hate.....it's indifference"
Geoff
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basildd
- UKTS Loco Painter & Decorator
- Posts: 7309
- Joined: Wed Dec 12, 2001 12:00 am
- Location: Moving ever northwards...
It would have helped if it hadn't been leaked the way it was, so that we could have at least set it up and then put out in a proper announcement that could have been portrayed in a positive light, instead of losing over a week whilst waiting for the fan cleaning department to do a site visit! As it was, everything became entangled and I didn't see the point of becoming an apologist for something that wasn't even there yet. If I had tried to look over the top, my head would have been shot off...lateagain wrote:It'll be short for me...
Thanks for the detailed explanation Dale, it might have helped earlier.
Geoff
What was annoying was the claim that files were being withdrawn so that they could reappear on a new site that was obviously trying to kill off UKTS. Nothing was further from the truth and I hope now that people can see for themselves that there is nothing underhand going on, we are not trying to create a super MT site and we really are on the same side - so all the furore going on was just damaging to all concerned. Plus the small matter that it takes time to see the wood from the trees. We would like now to devote our time and energy to going forward and I would hope that no matter what peoples' viewpoints are here, ultimately they/we all want the same things - a healthy future for trainsim... that we all share in.
Dale / BasilDD
Works Overhaul Stats - 23/04/02-29/02/04
Output - 348 (Stock / Locomotives) Customers - 156,677 downloads!!!
Works Overhaul Stats - 23/04/02-29/02/04
Output - 348 (Stock / Locomotives) Customers - 156,677 downloads!!!
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johndibben
- Bletchley Park:home of first programmable computer
- Posts: 14007
- Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2001 12:00 am
- Location: Bletchley
I've read it all now 
Appears reaonable. Founding members drawing up rules and vetting entry suggests the possiblility of exclusion. Not sure what would happen then. It doesn't exist and so doesn't matter at this time.
One thing we all do is talk of 'some people', 'others' and 'they'.
I was the first to point out EB was 'them' and not BA at the start of all this.
Nothing is clear unless everyone is named.
I'll share the blame for anything with anyone but I often havn't a clue who they are
Cheers
John
Appears reaonable. Founding members drawing up rules and vetting entry suggests the possiblility of exclusion. Not sure what would happen then. It doesn't exist and so doesn't matter at this time.
One thing we all do is talk of 'some people', 'others' and 'they'.
I was the first to point out EB was 'them' and not BA at the start of all this.
Nothing is clear unless everyone is named.
I'll share the blame for anything with anyone but I often havn't a clue who they are
Cheers
John
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Garthion
- Very Active Forum Member
- Posts: 1706
- Joined: Fri Feb 20, 2004 9:42 pm
- Location: Getting bored when not at a railway ;)
- Contact:
Hi all,
I'm not going to start making any arguements but would just like to point out one little fact that has appeared here, BATS forum et al, people are saying that the community has split into two.
QUESTION
what makes these two sub-communities different?
ANSWER:
One likes commercial stuff rather than freeware and the other prefers freeware over commercial.
I personaly don't see it this way, we are still the same community, one big (not so) happy family who share one interest, that of Train Simulation. If we all see things that way maybe things could begin to calm down a little? I post on the BATS forum, I post here I post on the 75069 Donationware Forum, I even post on Doctor Who forums, and they an get REALLY heated, what I don't want to see is the number of friendships that have grown from this community being destroyed over one silly and stupid mistake, I mean it's nearly 5 years since MSTS ame on the scene and many members have been on various forums since then and since UKTS became the prinipal forum for discussion we have, all of us, made many friends, mostly just by posting but some of us have met face to face, which we wouldn't have done if UKTS did not exist.
So here is my plea...
Please, if one is offered, can people accept any appologies made by anyone from any side in this silly arguement? The sooner peace is restored the sooner normality will occur.
Mickoo,
I know you feel offended by some posts, but as has ben said in many other topics, the best thing to do is just walk away for a short while, don't reply straight off, you're too good a person to retort the way you have, and I still respect you for what you do for the community.
The two John's are no help either,
You are both respected members of the community, but are both posting in this topic in a manner that can be read in an inflamatory way, as I said to Mickoo above, step back awhile, see what damage is being caused by all this hostility, and think "Why don't I try helping the communtiy, not help to destroy it?"
I am not trying to get anyone's backs up by this, just trying to get the community back together, as we are better as one than many are we not?
Please bear my points in mind if you feel the need to futher continue making an arguement that should, by now, have come to a natural end.
Cheers, with a fire extinguisher hany if the need arrises,
Dale Williams.
(I just thought it best to distinguish myself from Basildd as we share our first names;) )
I'm not going to start making any arguements but would just like to point out one little fact that has appeared here, BATS forum et al, people are saying that the community has split into two.
QUESTION
what makes these two sub-communities different?
ANSWER:
One likes commercial stuff rather than freeware and the other prefers freeware over commercial.
I personaly don't see it this way, we are still the same community, one big (not so) happy family who share one interest, that of Train Simulation. If we all see things that way maybe things could begin to calm down a little? I post on the BATS forum, I post here I post on the 75069 Donationware Forum, I even post on Doctor Who forums, and they an get REALLY heated, what I don't want to see is the number of friendships that have grown from this community being destroyed over one silly and stupid mistake, I mean it's nearly 5 years since MSTS ame on the scene and many members have been on various forums since then and since UKTS became the prinipal forum for discussion we have, all of us, made many friends, mostly just by posting but some of us have met face to face, which we wouldn't have done if UKTS did not exist.
So here is my plea...
Please, if one is offered, can people accept any appologies made by anyone from any side in this silly arguement? The sooner peace is restored the sooner normality will occur.
Mickoo,
I know you feel offended by some posts, but as has ben said in many other topics, the best thing to do is just walk away for a short while, don't reply straight off, you're too good a person to retort the way you have, and I still respect you for what you do for the community.
The two John's are no help either,
You are both respected members of the community, but are both posting in this topic in a manner that can be read in an inflamatory way, as I said to Mickoo above, step back awhile, see what damage is being caused by all this hostility, and think "Why don't I try helping the communtiy, not help to destroy it?"
I am not trying to get anyone's backs up by this, just trying to get the community back together, as we are better as one than many are we not?
Please bear my points in mind if you feel the need to futher continue making an arguement that should, by now, have come to a natural end.
Cheers, with a fire extinguisher hany if the need arrises,
Dale Williams.
(I just thought it best to distinguish myself from Basildd as we share our first names;) )
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johndibben
- Bletchley Park:home of first programmable computer
- Posts: 14007
- Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2001 12:00 am
- Location: Bletchley
I am. I'm also doing something as well as talking.Garthion wrote:The two John's are no help either,
You are both respected members of the community, but are both posting in this topic in a manner that can be read in an inflamatory way, as I said to Mickoo above, step back awhile, see what damage is being caused by all this hostility, and think "Why don't I try helping the communtiy, not help to destroy it?"
You did have the courage to make clear who you were talking about and so I'll take serious note of what you say.
Make no mistake. These discussions have not been moderated for a reason. If UKTS and the trainsimming community was seen to be being harmed they wouldn't have got this far. The minute they do, they will be locked. Anything else would imply UKTS was itself harming the trainsimming community and itself and would make no sense.
Matt has spoken wisely and said he'd appreciate it if the matter was closed. The matter rumbles on and may be uncomfortable for us as individuals and we will be open to criticism but let no one be in doubt of the benefits which have accrued from this situation.
There's an ever growing band of voluteers helping any way they can to assist, about 35 the last time I counted. Anyone can criticise but anyone can also volunteer. I had no hesitation. What of others?
Cheers
John
Last edited by johndibben on Thu Jan 12, 2006 10:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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NeutronIC
- Atomic Systems Team
- Posts: 11085
- Joined: Fri Oct 05, 2001 12:00 am
- Location: E11, London, England
- Contact:
On that note, can I now request that, without locking this thread, discussion is now finished. I'd love to not have to lock this thread as a tribute to just how great a strong dialog can be and still come out positively.
For discussion of any of the tangents covered on this thread such as the Association, please feel free to start a new topic - but I firmly request that discussions of the unfortunate events since 01/01/06 are now ended.
If you want to get involved in the work to get the CD's back and the missing content and stock replaced, drop a PM to either myself or Terry Cunliffe (terrycunliffe).
Other than that, I close this discussion by thanking everyone for their input and most importantly adding my appreciation for what has been a heated but well mannered debate.
Many thanks.
Matt.
PS. no, I mean it, don't even press reply.
For discussion of any of the tangents covered on this thread such as the Association, please feel free to start a new topic - but I firmly request that discussions of the unfortunate events since 01/01/06 are now ended.
If you want to get involved in the work to get the CD's back and the missing content and stock replaced, drop a PM to either myself or Terry Cunliffe (terrycunliffe).
Other than that, I close this discussion by thanking everyone for their input and most importantly adding my appreciation for what has been a heated but well mannered debate.
Many thanks.
Matt.
PS. no, I mean it, don't even press reply.
Dale W, sound words, on reflection l dont have any remorse or feel overly offended.
Whilst people were arguing with me they were not picking holes in anything else, l'd like to think the distraction merely deflected peoples attention and allowed those that can make things happen to work freely and resolve issues in the background.
l am under no illusion as to my status or standing here or anywhere else.
I shouldnt write the next below, but will as it might explain a bit of my retort...not that l have any excuse to be honest.
In the bigger picture l've more pressing concerns in the real world, a mother recovering in intensive care after major cancer surgery this evening, an unborn child requiring disability scanning in Adenbrooks Cambridge tomorrow. So you see all this really pales into insignificance and to be blunt was a welcome distraction from more stressing matters. I am sure there are many others here who have simular or god forbid, worse behind the scene scenarios to deal with, like many others, it is very easy to forget all that humanity and become wrapped up in it all here.
( Please no more on the above....except PM or email..., it may be wrong to write such, but feel it is important so that everyone can get the full picture. )
We are all human, none know of others issues behind faceless words written here.
Dales (MT) clarification post is perfect timing as l can now concentrate on more pressing matters.
I think the issue is done.
Kindest regards
Michael
Addendum, Oh bugga, sorry Matt spent too long forumlating the above and missed your new post to not carry on, is it possible to shunt mine above yours so it doesnt look like l'm ignoring your request ?.
Whilst people were arguing with me they were not picking holes in anything else, l'd like to think the distraction merely deflected peoples attention and allowed those that can make things happen to work freely and resolve issues in the background.
l am under no illusion as to my status or standing here or anywhere else.
I shouldnt write the next below, but will as it might explain a bit of my retort...not that l have any excuse to be honest.
In the bigger picture l've more pressing concerns in the real world, a mother recovering in intensive care after major cancer surgery this evening, an unborn child requiring disability scanning in Adenbrooks Cambridge tomorrow. So you see all this really pales into insignificance and to be blunt was a welcome distraction from more stressing matters. I am sure there are many others here who have simular or god forbid, worse behind the scene scenarios to deal with, like many others, it is very easy to forget all that humanity and become wrapped up in it all here.
( Please no more on the above....except PM or email..., it may be wrong to write such, but feel it is important so that everyone can get the full picture. )
We are all human, none know of others issues behind faceless words written here.
Dales (MT) clarification post is perfect timing as l can now concentrate on more pressing matters.
I think the issue is done.
Kindest regards
Michael
Addendum, Oh bugga, sorry Matt spent too long forumlating the above and missed your new post to not carry on, is it possible to shunt mine above yours so it doesnt look like l'm ignoring your request ?.