What he has done with the bin patch is fantastic. I must admit I have gone back to one of the 1.6 versions (which I am more than delighted with) as the latest was causing too much grief.
With the 1.6 patch no editing of locos is needed at all and I am perfectly happy going with that.
Withdrawn 1.7.xxxxxx
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Anonymizeruk
- Well Established Forum Member
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Well, having not visited ts.com for quite a while, I don't know exactly what happened (and, without meaning to be rude, don't really need to know - not my intention to drag it up here etc!)
What I would like to say is that I have appreciated Georges efforts immensely. Bugs are something train simmers are used to, so it's no big deal to me if I have to work around a few niggles.
I hope George doesnt give-up his work!
Cheers
Gaz
What I would like to say is that I have appreciated Georges efforts immensely. Bugs are something train simmers are used to, so it's no big deal to me if I have to work around a few niggles.
I hope George doesnt give-up his work!
Cheers
Gaz
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jbilton
- Very Active Forum Member
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Hi
Well hopefully his lack of English will not stop him from understanding the complaints are from a few...where as the gratitude is from many.
Nothing is really new.
It has been discussed at length before, that certainly steam locos have a different eng file and physics.Not sure about electrics.
But the easy way is to set the file up as per the real thing.
ie
Wagon section....how many wheels in contact with the rails...how big are they.....How heavy is the loco.
One thing you don't need to alter is friction or adhesion....they are fairly standard.(The sim alters these for different weather conditions)
Engine section read number of wheels as number of driven axles/traction motors.
Personally I've just done a couple of class 25, and they are performing perfectly AFAIK.
The other thing you can upset by not getting the basics correct is braking of course. If you insist on having one big wheel, then braking will not respond correctly.
I used to read the American forums... but then I started to realise they were very backward in some msts respects, and certainly not open to new ideas.....the wheel seemed to be re-invented every other week.
Cheers
Jon
Well hopefully his lack of English will not stop him from understanding the complaints are from a few...where as the gratitude is from many.
Nothing is really new.
It has been discussed at length before, that certainly steam locos have a different eng file and physics.Not sure about electrics.
But the easy way is to set the file up as per the real thing.
ie
Wagon section....how many wheels in contact with the rails...how big are they.....How heavy is the loco.
One thing you don't need to alter is friction or adhesion....they are fairly standard.(The sim alters these for different weather conditions)
Engine section read number of wheels as number of driven axles/traction motors.
Personally I've just done a couple of class 25, and they are performing perfectly AFAIK.
The other thing you can upset by not getting the basics correct is braking of course. If you insist on having one big wheel, then braking will not respond correctly.
I used to read the American forums... but then I started to realise they were very backward in some msts respects, and certainly not open to new ideas.....the wheel seemed to be re-invented every other week.
Cheers
Jon
------------------------Supporting whats good in the British community------------------------
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alisterbetts
- Very Active Forum Member
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- Location: City of Bristol, UK
- Contact:
I'm using 1.7.051220 and for the vast majority of items it's fine - the sound of a double-header powering properly more than makes up for having to alter some adhesion files IMO
Lost your love of life? Too much apple pie!
Have a look at my pics at http://alisterbetts.fotopic.net/
Have a look at my pics at http://alisterbetts.fotopic.net/
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ballymoss9018
- Been on the forums for a while
- Posts: 179
- Joined: Sat Nov 25, 2006 9:55 pm
bin1.7
The easy fix is for George to revert to the default settings for adhesion and num wheels.
Otherwise any models released would need to have an extra version to suit the bin users, as there are still people out there running default MSTS whom
need providing for as well.
If the default adhesion settings are restored all files including the ones with real world physics will be catered for
From my testing with the latest patch the diesels were fine, but the steam locomotives sllipped uncontrolably.
All these had been thoroughly adjusted by Supergoods and were working fine on the earlier versions of bin.
heers
Ian
Otherwise any models released would need to have an extra version to suit the bin users, as there are still people out there running default MSTS whom
need providing for as well.
If the default adhesion settings are restored all files including the ones with real world physics will be catered for
From my testing with the latest patch the diesels were fine, but the steam locomotives sllipped uncontrolably.
All these had been thoroughly adjusted by Supergoods and were working fine on the earlier versions of bin.
heers
Ian
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ballymoss9018
- Been on the forums for a while
- Posts: 179
- Joined: Sat Nov 25, 2006 9:55 pm
Re: bin1.7
When you say 'fix' that presupposes there is something needing fixed; if the current BIN (1.7xx) now works more realistically and correctly then to unpick that is not a 'fix', rather a 'fudge'
I'm not sure designers need to go as far as uploading 2 versions. Many already come with edit instructions for users to follow so all that is required is a note to say what the design spec is and what the edit is. People can then set the thing to their requirements.
Peter
I'm not sure designers need to go as far as uploading 2 versions. Many already come with edit instructions for users to follow so all that is required is a note to say what the design spec is and what the edit is. People can then set the thing to their requirements.
Peter
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ronald parkin
- Very Active Forum Member
- Posts: 1741
- Joined: Thu Mar 10, 2005 10:08 pm
- Location: Sheffield Yorkshire
Hi All, Very interesting discussion. I am using the very latest BinV1.7.0512 and how that I have fixed my Wheelslip problem created by third parties it is absolutley great. I run MSTS as it came out of the box and I like it like that,no wholesale meddling with parameters and tweakings, and I know that when George comes out with the next Bin Patch it will work for me.
The next few lines are going to be a bit of home truths and alot of people are not going to like it.
George can only work with the Train.exe and cannot alter Microsoft codes ( see EULA2 ) in your trainsimulator folder,yet everybody can alter them for their own personal use and that's the trouble,when George uses the correct Trainsim adhesion factor things don't work because of peoples tweaking and then uploading the tweaked loco for others to innocently down load. Example: downloaded a class 37 the other day and it would not move because of a tweaked wrong adhesion parameter,yet when I changed that one for the Default parameter it went like a dream.
So what is the solution. I personally dont expect George to even attempt to try to compensate for all the tweaks that are out here.Our friends across the pond have altered MSTS Physic's in their strive for realism and
that's why they are having trouble.So one patch for us/One for them or being brutal, if it do'es not work for you don't us it.
Regards
Ron P
The next few lines are going to be a bit of home truths and alot of people are not going to like it.
George can only work with the Train.exe and cannot alter Microsoft codes ( see EULA2 ) in your trainsimulator folder,yet everybody can alter them for their own personal use and that's the trouble,when George uses the correct Trainsim adhesion factor things don't work because of peoples tweaking and then uploading the tweaked loco for others to innocently down load. Example: downloaded a class 37 the other day and it would not move because of a tweaked wrong adhesion parameter,yet when I changed that one for the Default parameter it went like a dream.
So what is the solution. I personally dont expect George to even attempt to try to compensate for all the tweaks that are out here.Our friends across the pond have altered MSTS Physic's in their strive for realism and
that's why they are having trouble.So one patch for us/One for them or being brutal, if it do'es not work for you don't us it.
Regards
Ron P
I'm in no way complaining George, in fact I admire his hard work and perserverance. I would just like to post my problems that I have encountered, in case they may help (by the way I was running the recently withdrawn v1.7)
On all my London Underground trains I had no throttle (ie. it would not move, and yes I checked the reverser and pantograph). If I did get the train moving, going down a hill due to gravity, I had no brakes and the emergency brakes were non functional either despite the HUD displaying that the brakes were operational.
Apart from that I haven't found any more problems.
On all my London Underground trains I had no throttle (ie. it would not move, and yes I checked the reverser and pantograph). If I did get the train moving, going down a hill due to gravity, I had no brakes and the emergency brakes were non functional either despite the HUD displaying that the brakes were operational.
Apart from that I haven't found any more problems.
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ronald parkin
- Very Active Forum Member
- Posts: 1741
- Joined: Thu Mar 10, 2005 10:08 pm
- Location: Sheffield Yorkshire
Hi, Post this info on Georges forum, http://mstsbin.uktrainsim.com/eng/eng.html under guest book.
This is just the sort of feed back he needs.
regards
Ron P
This is just the sort of feed back he needs.
regards
Ron P
Glad your diesels are working fine Ronald , but try anything in steam and try and get up a 1 in 50 grade with a full load.
Now all I said was that whatever was adjusted in the latest version re num wheels and adhesion needs to be reversed back to the default settings.
Due to the steam, diesel and electric parameters obviously being written by 3 different people , as we have known for ages and confirmed by Supergoods a few posts ago, while it seems that the num wheels and adhesion settings are obviously a general item affecting all three.
With any editing of the exe file , the alterations need to be working on all, not just diesels and electrics.
You are quick to blame the yanks for altering files to more favourable and realistic settings ,but really, these tweaks which have been going on for years , have contributed for a better sim way before the time of George.
All that is needed at this stage is the latest version to have the defaults restored in the exe file and all will be fine.
We in Australia have a similar setup to what you Europeans have in air brake protocols . and we have replaced the US brake with the correct settings ie 110 main reservoir and 70psi brake pipe with no emergency reservoirs,and it works flawlessly.
As we realise that there are lots of different standards around the world
it is a lot better to have the default settings re physics and brake in the exe file so ALL locomotives at least pull near what they are supposed to do in real life without slipping continuously.
Yes , I was impressed myself when testing a multi unit setup of diesels with all working and slipping if driven over the top, but the adjustments were obviously not tested with steam and George has been notified, and is obviously the reason why the latest bin has been rescinded.
To do this George doesn't need to compensate for all the tweaks but simply reverse any changes made to the adhesion and num wheels, so all locomotives perform as intended.
That way it doesn't matter whether you have default settings or tweaked settings as all will work fine.
George has done a fantastic job with the bin patches re memory, frame rates , cab changing ( though steam was obviously neglected there as well) due to there being no fuel in the loco after changing cabs.
Ian (supergoods) is correct as I got a similar answer when querying about the steam loco settings , ie drive a diesel.
Obviously George if contacted directly via the website is at least listening to all reports of bugs , and not ignoring items relating to steam locomotives.
To sum up , the bin patch as fantastic as it is needs to cater for all types of locomotion and not concentrate on certain types.
Better to have a setup where all types of loco , whether setup for real world physics or Mickey mouse physics will at least perform corectly in the sim.
George has been notified and is obviously looking for any feedback on any of the changes, so if anybody finds anything unusual report it to the site direct and it will be looked at.
Cheers
Ian
Now all I said was that whatever was adjusted in the latest version re num wheels and adhesion needs to be reversed back to the default settings.
Due to the steam, diesel and electric parameters obviously being written by 3 different people , as we have known for ages and confirmed by Supergoods a few posts ago, while it seems that the num wheels and adhesion settings are obviously a general item affecting all three.
With any editing of the exe file , the alterations need to be working on all, not just diesels and electrics.
You are quick to blame the yanks for altering files to more favourable and realistic settings ,but really, these tweaks which have been going on for years , have contributed for a better sim way before the time of George.
All that is needed at this stage is the latest version to have the defaults restored in the exe file and all will be fine.
We in Australia have a similar setup to what you Europeans have in air brake protocols . and we have replaced the US brake with the correct settings ie 110 main reservoir and 70psi brake pipe with no emergency reservoirs,and it works flawlessly.
As we realise that there are lots of different standards around the world
it is a lot better to have the default settings re physics and brake in the exe file so ALL locomotives at least pull near what they are supposed to do in real life without slipping continuously.
Yes , I was impressed myself when testing a multi unit setup of diesels with all working and slipping if driven over the top, but the adjustments were obviously not tested with steam and George has been notified, and is obviously the reason why the latest bin has been rescinded.
To do this George doesn't need to compensate for all the tweaks but simply reverse any changes made to the adhesion and num wheels, so all locomotives perform as intended.
That way it doesn't matter whether you have default settings or tweaked settings as all will work fine.
George has done a fantastic job with the bin patches re memory, frame rates , cab changing ( though steam was obviously neglected there as well) due to there being no fuel in the loco after changing cabs.
Ian (supergoods) is correct as I got a similar answer when querying about the steam loco settings , ie drive a diesel.
Obviously George if contacted directly via the website is at least listening to all reports of bugs , and not ignoring items relating to steam locomotives.
To sum up , the bin patch as fantastic as it is needs to cater for all types of locomotion and not concentrate on certain types.
Better to have a setup where all types of loco , whether setup for real world physics or Mickey mouse physics will at least perform corectly in the sim.
George has been notified and is obviously looking for any feedback on any of the changes, so if anybody finds anything unusual report it to the site direct and it will be looked at.
Cheers
Ian
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phill70
- Has a sign reading.. Its NOT the end of the world!
- Posts: 8767
- Joined: Mon Sep 23, 2002 8:01 pm
- Location: Basingstoke, where you just go around in circles and end up where you started.
Firstly, as far as I am aware George does monitor the forums, so he can take in any comments, good or bad.
Secondly, we have all come a hell of a long way in the last six years, and George has given the old dog a new leash of life, keep going George, and very well done.
Thirdly, brake pressures, main res in the UK is 110-140 psi, and brake pipe is 70-72.5 psi depending on what you are driving.
Emergency res, does not exist under that name in the UK, its called the aux res, but does the same job.
Glyn
Secondly, we have all come a hell of a long way in the last six years, and George has given the old dog a new leash of life, keep going George, and very well done.
Thirdly, brake pressures, main res in the UK is 110-140 psi, and brake pipe is 70-72.5 psi depending on what you are driving.
Emergency res, does not exist under that name in the UK, its called the aux res, but does the same job.
Glyn
Glyn Phillips