Thames Mersey / West Kirby Question

Lad491 · Post by **Lad491** » Wed Aug 24, 2005 10:37 pm

Im doing the West Kirby circular commuter run, as discussed on another thread. I started off using the modern era version of the route, however this gives me overhead wires but no catenary gantries. Im assuming therefore that in the era being represented it wasnt electrified, so i should be using the steam era and diesels - is that right?

Was the stock used just DMU's or was the service ever provided using Diesel loco power with Mk1 or Mk2 coaches?

Any advice welcomed.

jbilton · Post by **jbilton** » Thu Aug 25, 2005 1:28 am

Hi
No I think you'll find they were (are) third rail electrified.

http://easyweb.easynet.co.uk/~gsgleaves/503h.htm

Love to see one of these units in msts.

Class 502s worked Southport.

http://forums.uktrainsim.com/viewtopic. ... =southport

Cheers
Jon

Lad491 · Post by **Lad491** » Thu Aug 25, 2005 6:26 am

Thanks for that Jon - Its been electrified a long time, I didnt know that. So I'll have to use the steam era version of the route to get rid of the overhead cat wires, but i guess that then rules out third rail too

Im not even sure if 3rd rail was incorporated on TM - ive never seen it anywhere, maybe Dave can answer that for me. Otherwise peeps will just have to use their imagination

So ... I need to change the consist, either to a 502 if there is one for MSTS, or one of the 507's which Warship is using in his New Brighton activity.

Okey dokey - thanks again for the info

mjspeed · Post by **mjspeed** » Thu Aug 25, 2005 7:29 am

You don't have to run the steam version to remove overhead wires - just uncheck the wires option in the advanced display tab of the options menu. I've been running the electric version without visible wires, and it makes a big difference to the appearance of sidings etc.

Because MSTS only allows 1 track texture, theres no 3rd/4th rail on TM, and I don't think the route was built with 3rd rail track pieces originally (unlike other offerings such as LBE or WCW). Its either all 3rd rail, or none at all unfortunately

jbilton · Post by **jbilton** » Thu Aug 25, 2005 7:58 am

Lad491 wrote: or one of the 507's which Warship is using in his New Brighton activity.

Okey dokey - thanks again for the info

Hi
You'll find good information here on the current running.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Rail_Class_507

and here

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Merseyrail

and a day to day website for the units

http://www.geocities.com/class507and508/

Cheers
Jon

Lad491 · Post by **Lad491** » Thu Aug 25, 2005 11:38 am

Thanks again Jon - Ive gone for the same 507 units as Warship is using to save the amount of stock people have to download, and only needing one fix to the eng/wag files too

I have last years timetable which shows services run in the loop out and back from West kirby so thats what im doing, using the real timetable for all services.

It gets a bit scary as all services come together in the loop at James St (I think) with New Brighton and Chester cross country services all meeting there. In the rush hour (im basing mine on the 8:06am service) train interval is 2 minutes or less at that point around the loop, so im expecting heaps of signal checks and significant delays. I dont know how the real services manage it.

The only boring bit is just seeing 507's round the loop. I'll add freight services from West Kirby to Birkenhead and back for variety but im not sure what else i can do and still keep authentic to the timetable.

Anyhow player service is done and tested. Some Ai traffic is done but the rest will get finished tonight. Then some testing. Might be ready by Bank Holiday Monday.

Warship · Post by **Warship** » Thu Aug 25, 2005 1:20 pm

Laurie
Since we last exchanged e-mails Iâ€™ve stopped using the 507â€™s that I used in the test run I sent you, mainly because of the error in the .wag files, I felt that others would also have to correct those to get any activities to work correctly. Also because their displayed speed is in Km/h and not MPH.

Since then Iâ€™ve downloaded and have been using the 508â€™s modelled by â€œMaking Tracksâ€

Warship · Post by **Warship** » Thu Aug 25, 2005 1:30 pm

Lad491 wrote: Was the stock used just DMU's or was the service ever provided using Diesel loco power with Mk1 or Mk2 coaches?

Any advice welcomed.

To the best of my knowledge, (and I'm willing to be corrected) these were the first underground lines built electrified, third rail. Where as the early London underground were in fact steam hauled, using condensing Engines.

Greg

ccsdc · Post by **ccsdc** » Thu Aug 25, 2005 1:58 pm

See this thread re: the Rock Ferry signalling problem

http://forums.uktrainsim.com/viewtopic.php?t=44933

Dave

Warship · Post by **Warship** » Thu Aug 25, 2005 2:41 pm

Many Thanks, David

btw you have a pm (I hope)

Greg.

Lad491 · Post by **Lad491** » Thu Aug 25, 2005 3:03 pm

Thanks Greg for your comments. I'll look at the 508's. Are the cabs correctly aliased or have i got to fiddle about with the eng files. If fiddling is necessary then i cant see much difference between the two.

Also Iâ€™ve noted a problem at Rock Ferry which prevents running from Chester to Birkenhead (similar to the one at James St..)

Luckily im not going that way and i can cheat with the AI services by starting them closer and adjusting the start times to work to the timetable.

So .... 508's for the player service

I'll work on it some more tonight and see how it looks. Wasn't there a problem in running services around the loop at closer than 10 minute intervals? I'll be aiming for 2 minute intervals unless that causes major problems.

Since there seems to be so much by way of activities for TM now ive decided this will be my last and i'll turn my attention to less favoured routes (even though i keep finding myself drawn back to it - its such a great route

) Probably Paddington to Penzance will be my next venture.

Warship · Post by **Warship** » Thu Aug 25, 2005 3:10 pm

To me they are correct ........ I guess it depends how deep you want to "fiddle" ...... this is from Kengi's readme file which comes with the cabview......... >>

If you use common.cab

1 Unzip [455cabV1.zip] and rename [CABVIEW] to [455cab].
2 Put [455cab] into the folder of [common.cab].
3 Put [class455C.cvf] into the folder of [CABVIEW] of your trainset.
4 Change next line of eng-file.

CabView ( xxxx.cvf ) -----> CabView ( class455C.cvf )

Couldn't be simpler

The other thing to mention is that these cabviews give you a truer perspective of what a driver would see in the real world.

Greg.

Lad491 · Post by **Lad491** » Thu Aug 25, 2005 6:12 pm

Hmmm... ok but it seems just changing one line in each eng and wag file of the 507 to read carriage is easier than doing that - so i might stick with what ive got

Warship · Post by **Warship** » Thu Aug 25, 2005 9:06 pm

Well the skins of the 507's you plan to use are more in keeping with the service and era, ie recent, than the 508's I intend to use, which are in BR colours, when the service went from NB-Hoot: Hoot-WK: WK-NB, as discussed earlier in another thread.

Greg.

Lad491 · Post by **Lad491** » Thu Aug 25, 2005 9:22 pm

Ive just noticed that the 507's are actually included in the stock which came on the TM CD and the eng and wag files have been correctly modified already

So ive deleted the original consist and the stock i downloaded and im creating a new set from the CD stock - that way no alteration will be necessary at all. Ive done all AI traffic now except some freight fillers i want to put on the Birkenhead to Kirby section, so its waiting a test run. Tomorrow possibly.

Atomic Systems

Thames Mersey / West Kirby Question

Thames Mersey / West Kirby Question

Re: Thames Mersey / West Kirby Question