TM Merseyrail/James St signalling problem

[spartacus]

I've been trying to produce an activity on TM of the New Brighton line, based a currect practice. However I've run into a problem that the AI services always come accross a red on the Hamilton Sq bound platform 3 at James St. There's nothing coming down, or going up to from the Hunts Cross-Southport line, and I've made sure that none of the paths (New Brighton, West Kirkby + Rock Ferry returns) cross themselves anywhere.

THis line has produced a problem for me on explore route before, but that was just a one off, so basically I wondered if anyone else has had any problems here before. The first service is a New Brighton line train, so it doesn't even cross another path until Bidston East, near Birkenhead depot.

Cheers.

[ccsdc]

I've been trying to produce an activity on TM of the New Brighton line, based a currect practice. However I've run into a problem that the AI services always come accross a red on the Hamilton Sq bound platform 3 at James St. There's nothing coming down, or going up to from the Hunts Cross-Southport line, and I've made sure that none of the paths (New Brighton, West Kirkby + Rock Ferry returns) cross themselves anywhere.

THis line has produced a problem for me on explore route before, but that was just a one off, so basically I wondered if anyone else has had any problems here before. The first service is a New Brighton line train, so it doesn't even cross another path until Bidston East, near Birkenhead depot.

Cheers.

What headway are you trying to run on the AI traffic around the loop? The current practice is 5 minutes in off peak I think which is basically a 15 minute service of each of the 3 lines, West Kirby, New Brighton and Rock Ferry.

I could not get this to work so i reduced the service to a 20 minute interval on each line and then it worked. The problem is that it probably needs more signals around the loop, and 2 aspect instead of 3 aspect which will create more signalling blocks.

Dave

[spartacus]

I've been trying to run 5 minutes through the loop, which was working through the stations up to James St. Still doesn't explain where there's a red at James St though, when there's no conflicts until Bidston East. Might have to find a compromise with some services terminating at James St, then starting just after.

I've also had problems loading and unloading passengers at the stations, which would incur a 'failed to stop'. It's something I've found on a couple of other activities on TM, although others tend to work of you stop 0.00m from the station. Any advice?

[ccsdc]

I've also had problems loading and unloading passengers at the stations, which would incur a 'failed to stop'. It's something I've found on a couple of other activities on TM, although others tend to work of you stop 0.00m from the station. Any advice?

I have never fathomed this aspect of MSTS fully - at some stations you can stop up to 0.05 miles away and it still lets you unload passengers, but at other stations you have to get it right on the money 0.00 miles beofre it recognises that you are at the station stop.

Another thought on the signal problem - is this happening in the AE or in the sim itself? Sometimes I have seen signals that refuse to clear when you run the act in the AE, but they perform OK in the real sim.

Dave

[spartacus]

It's occuring on both AI and in the sim. When the problem occurs in AI only I've found it can be cured by reloading the activity. In this case it looks to be a form of signalling error.

[Lad491]

have never fathomed this aspect of MSTS fully - at some stations you can stop up to 0.05 miles away and it still lets you unload passengers, but at other stations you have to get it right on the money 0.00 miles beofre it recognises that you are at the station stop.

I cant say ive ever noticed this - on TM or any other route. I always stop the player service in the most central position for the station, usually with the coaches central to the station buildings if there are any. I never bother with the station stop point - not ever, and have never had a failed to stop problem. Perhaps ive just been lucky.

On my current activity there are several stops where the stopping point has to be -0.05 and one where it has to be 0.09 in order to fit the train on the platform or prevent overrunning a signal, but even this doesn't cause a problem

If time permits tonight, or later in the week, i'll have a play around and see what happens on my installation

[Warship]

Hi …..
Sorry to resurrect this …. but

I have been getting both these same TWO probs in the Wirral line ……..


Prob #1 …. Sim does not recognise that train has stopped.

For that matter it hasn’t yet once recognised that the consist has even left the station either – lol –– this was an activity in it early stages, New Brighton to Rock Ferry, with NO AI paths or consists, just the player path. The “Next Stationâ€

[Lad491]

[quote]The “Next Stationâ€

[spartacus]

The problem at James St also occurs somewhere near Werrington Jn. on the fictional ECML with certain locos, if I remember correctly.

The station stop problem seems to be fairly common with stations off the main lines on TMv4, especially if your train is quite a bit shorter than the platforms. I think some local services stopping at Northampton are also effected by this, but stopping 0.00 miles away(or near) solves it there. Something that would probably need a patch to correct.

[ccsdc]

Ok I have just tried a run round the Liverpool loop from New Brighton to Rock Ferry.

I cannot replicate the next station problem - I get the Loading/Unloading prompt at every station. The only station that I had a slight problem with is Moorfields, where I had to stop right on the 0.00, but the others were not that sensitive.

I did manage to replicate the red signal problem at James Street, so I have moved the interactive further away from the switch and it now works OK.

I have just uploaded a patch file 4-1 which is awaiting approval.

Dave

[Warship]

If you want to drop me a PM and i'll take a look at the activity paths for you and test them on my setup to see if i get the same problems as you.

Many thanks.....................

OK - but can you send attachments in a PM? and if so how?

Greg

(Edited for spelling & removal of signature)

[Warship]

The station stop problem seems to be fairly common with stations off the main lines on TMv4

Hmmmm ????

This would suggest that something maybe missing from the platforms on the branch lines, but what? All the platform markers are there, so what triggers the "Actual Time" of arrival and departure? Any ideas?

Greg.

(Edited for removal of signature)

[Warship]

I did manage to replicate the red signal problem at James Street, so I have moved the interactive further away from the switch and it now works OK.

Many Thanks .... as I thought, I just wasn't sure if the red pyramid 'interactive' was too close to the points or too close to the signal, but it's good to know you managed to fix it. Now all I have to do is do the same - but this time I'll back up the route first

I have just uploaded a patch file 4-1 which is awaiting approval.

Do you know what issues does this address & is this available here?

Please ignore the above dumb a**e question - lol

Greg.

(Edited for removal of signature)
(Second edit)

[Warship]

Just a thought ......

Does the author of the route use these forums?
And has anyone informed him of these potential problems?

If he doesn't know he can't fix them / nor avoid them in future releases.

Greg.

[Lad491]

Many thanks.....................

OK - but can you send attachments in a PM? and if so how

Sorry I wasn't clear. I meant if you wanted me to take a look at them for you to drop me a PM, then i'll give you an e mail to send the files too. However, with the patch Dave has just released you may find that isn't necessary anymore

Does the author of the route use these forums?

ccsdc is Dave Corfield the route author - so yes he does monitor all TM threads closely