Wheelsets doing graphically odd things when front coupling

saddletank · Post by **saddletank** » Mon Apr 26, 2004 9:55 pm

I am seeing this a lot when testing activities for Highworth. Sometimes the wheelset of a wagon will disappear, sometimes it rises up and embeds into the body of the wagon, other times it falls out of the axleboxes and runs half sunk in the ballast.

I know it is related to the front coupler bug. I have seen it happen to quite a few wagons and coaches of the Skipton-Carlisle stock as well which I know is TSM-built.

I know it only happens with models built in TSM. But not all of them. I have an extensive collection of stock for the Highworth route, most of it TSM-built and one authors stock is fine, on another authors work some models consistently do this.

Anyone know why and what the fix is please?

buffy500 · Post by **buffy500** » Mon Apr 26, 2004 10:28 pm

GMAX ?

mikesimpson · Post by **mikesimpson** » Mon Apr 26, 2004 10:52 pm

3D Canvas ?

LucaZone · Post by **LucaZone** » Tue Apr 27, 2004 7:33 am

untested models?

decapod · Post by **decapod** » Tue Apr 27, 2004 8:46 am

I've seen it happen too.

I don't suspect the S files are wrong, there is very little difference between the packages on the output, but odd values in WAG files can affect wheelsets.
There was a case where SFM changes a wheelsize incorrectly and the wheels vanished.

ianmacmillan · Post by **ianmacmillan** » Tue Apr 27, 2004 10:22 am

I wonder if it is the wheel part that is moving or the texture.

Looks like a test run on the S&C is required.

robin · Post by **robin** » Tue Apr 27, 2004 11:26 am

decapod wrote:I've seen it happen too.

I don't suspect the S files are wrong, there is very little difference between the packages on the output, but odd values in WAG files can affect wheelsets.
There was a case where SFM changes a wheelsize incorrectly and the wheels vanished.

I agree I doubt if the .s files are to blame so it is not a TSM issue. The only time I have experienced similar results is when an eng or wag file is incorrect and certain parameters (I can't remember which unfortunatly) are being defaulted or just wrongly entered. In these instances adjustment of the wag or eng files has fixed it.

saddletank · Post by **saddletank** » Tue Apr 27, 2004 1:46 pm

Thanks, I'll compare wag files of known unaffected stock with these ones that are playing up.

And Lucazone - this is the testing stage

saddletank · Post by **saddletank** » Wed Apr 28, 2004 9:09 pm

decapod wrote:I've seen it happen too.

I don't suspect the S files are wrong, there is very little difference between the packages on the output, but odd values in WAG files can affect wheelsets.
There was a case where SFM changes a wheelsize incorrectly and the wheels vanished.

I do not think it is the wag file since two wagons I'm using use exactly the same wag file (they are 2 versions of the same wagon) apart from the line of text in the "wagon (..." name line at the top.

One of these consistently exhibits weird wheel graphics when front coupled, the other does not.

I'm convinced it's in the .s file somewhere. Or the texture application, since apart from the wagon name these are the only 2 differences in these 2 wagons.

Any other suggestions?

robin · Post by **robin** » Wed Apr 28, 2004 9:22 pm

saddletank wrote:
decapod wrote:I've seen it happen too.

I don't suspect the S files are wrong, there is very little difference between the packages on the output, but odd values in WAG files can affect wheelsets.
There was a case where SFM changes a wheelsize incorrectly and the wheels vanished.
I do not think it is the wag file since two wagons I'm using use exactly the same wag file (they are 2 versions of the same wagon) apart from the line of text in the "wagon (..." name line at the top.

One of these consistently exhibits weird wheel graphics when front coupled, the other does not.

I'm convinced it's in the .s file somewhere. Or the texture application, since apart from the wagon name these are the only 2 differences in these 2 wagons.

Any other suggestions?

If I am interpreting you correctly one wagon is a repaint of another? If that is so I can't see how the shape file can have anything to do with it as it will be the same on the OK and the weird one. Equally it is hard to think of a reason that the texture is causing the issue.

I guess you will have to get more specific to get a better answer.

saddletank · Post by **saddletank** » Wed Apr 28, 2004 9:36 pm

Hi Robin. Look in the Highworth_PO_Wagons folder. Cald_3P_LOVATT_EMPTY.wag does funny things with it's front axle when front coupled (try activity #1). Cald_3P_LOVATT_NAVVIE.wag has no such problem (see activity #3). I have just noticed that the derailrailforce is different but surely this can't affect it?

Cald_3P_LOVATT_DIRT.wag seems OK too (see activity #2) - this is the same as the EMPTY wagon but with a load. I'm deeply puzzled by all this.

I have tried contacting Mark by his atomic mail address but his mailbox is always full.

Mark, if you are reading this please get in touch!

robin · Post by **robin** » Thu Apr 29, 2004 11:39 am

saddletank wrote:Hi Robin. Look in the Highworth_PO_Wagons folder. Cald_3P_LOVATT_EMPTY.wag does funny things with it's front axle when front coupled (try activity #1). Cald_3P_LOVATT_NAVVIE.wag has no such problem (see activity #3). I have just noticed that the derailrailforce is different but surely this can't affect it?

Cald_3P_LOVATT_DIRT.wag seems OK too (see activity #2) - this is the same as the EMPTY wagon but with a load. I'm deeply puzzled by all this.

I have tried contacting Mark by his atomic mail address but his mailbox is always full.

Mark, if you are reading this please get in touch!

I'll have a look and try and recreate it. I will try creating a wag file for it using one that we know works OK and see what happens. Very odd though.

alan2 · Post by **alan2** » Mon May 03, 2004 1:37 am

May I suggest that the shape could be an older version?

Way to eliminate the Shape would be to re-name the shape and textures to suit the working wagon and see if that then has the problem.

I noticed this effect with a few wagons. I am going to build a test wagon and then try to get it to do this. My suspicion is that the shape is built then in the animations the Set motion button has been pressed. (while animating) which has caused the error..

Only thing is to test it out.

saddletank · Post by **saddletank** » Mon May 03, 2004 2:02 am

Not sure I follow you Alan. The wagon in question is v1.0 and no further (or earlier) versions were made.

You now have the CD so you can test this yourself.

alan2 · Post by **alan2** » Mon May 03, 2004 2:22 am

Yup, will do. (going to bed first got recon mission for Peak rail in morning lol)

also which consist are these wagons used in? eg activity?