Class 306 Coming Sooon??

jimbob · Post by **jimbob** » Sat Nov 08, 2003 1:24 am

Got to try & keep it near the top!

lateagain · Post by **lateagain** » Sun Nov 09, 2003 11:45 am

I'm loosing the plot here with the difference between the 306 & 506 but am old enough to have commuted on whatever class ran in and out of Liverpool Street. They were roomy comfortable and as I remember fairly quiet. Compared with "Hell on the Central Line" (Nothings changed there in terms of comfort in 40 years!) they were a joy to travel on. The sliding doors were a plus on routes which subsequently had slam door stock. There was always some twit who left a door open and delayed the train. You'd have thought that whoever was next to it would have closed it, but sometimes nobody was.

One thing I will say is that the B&W photo shows the stock in the formation I remember. Trains were long. Not the 3 car units as used in Manchester. I'm surprised at the Upminster Shots. I thought that the Romford to Upminster link was run by DMU's? You have to realise that as a commuter I would have been totally ignorant of what ran then on the Fenchurch Street Line that passes through Upminster but I thought that this line always used Slam Door Stock and at least 8? car trains.

With my renewed interest in Railway history, largely due to MSTS, I've been unable to find any reference to the colour schemes that this stock ran on the Eastern Region. You didn't care what colour it was at the time as long as it was on time and got you there.

Geoff

jimbob · Post by **jimbob** » Sun Nov 09, 2003 5:08 pm

lateagain wrote:I'm loosing the plot here with the difference between the 306 & 506 but am old enough to have commuted on whatever class ran in and out of Liverpool Street. They were roomy comfortable and as I remember fairly quiet. Compared with "Hell on the Central Line" (Nothings changed there in terms of comfort in 40 years!) they were a joy to travel on. The sliding doors were a plus on routes which subsequently had slam door stock. There was always some twit who left a door open and delayed the train. You'd have thought that whoever was next to it would have closed it, but sometimes nobody was.

One thing I will say is that the B&W photo shows the stock in the formation I remember. Trains were long. Not the 3 car units as used in Manchester. I'm surprised at the Upminster Shots. I thought that the Romford to Upminster link was run by DMU's? You have to realise that as a commuter I would have been totally ignorant of what ran then on the Fenchurch Street Line that passes through Upminster but I thought that this line always used Slam Door Stock and at least 8? car trains.

With my renewed interest in Railway history, largely due to MSTS, I've been unable to find any reference to the colour schemes that this stock ran on the Eastern Region. You didn't care what colour it was at the time as long as it was on time and got you there.

Geoff

It would have deffinatly have been a 306 you would have travelled on around here. 9 car trains were the norm with these sets. You are very right about Romfor-Upminster it was run by DMU's until well after the 306's were replaced by the 315's, the shots of a 306 on the Romford-Upminster are reacent ones as Ilford has preserved 306017 & its used on special occasions, I belive the shots were of the 125 or 150th aniversary of that strech.
The liveries were as far as I am aware only BR green & BR blue, didn't get grey/blue, don't quote me on that tho! lol

jimbob · Post by **jimbob** » Fri Nov 21, 2003 12:28 am

Any news on these old girls yet?
I must say that the new 304's do look tip top! Does that mean 305, 308, & 504's are on the way?

chriscooper · Post by **chriscooper** » Fri Nov 21, 2003 12:45 am

I managed a trip last time the 306 was running. It was doing Liverpool St - Shenfield in May 2002 (I think), something to do with a steam special that was running from Liverpool St - Norwich. It was suprising just how nice it was to ride on, especially compared to the 315s usually used on that route, and I was amused by the confusion of 'normal' passengers who wern't sure whether they were getting on the right train. One man after being told this was the train he wanted said that he was unsure because it seemed far to posh compared to the normal trains, and was shocked to here it was over 50 years old. It was also due to run later on in 2002 between Manninghtree and Harwich for the Harwich sea festival which I also attended, but sadly after a hellish journey from Loughborough I arrived an hour later than I had planned to find a 312 operating the service (i was pretty pissed of, but had it been this year and a 360

) as the 306 had failed. This was made worse by the fact that the 312 had no guard so we sat for over an hour until one arrived, making me miss most of the festival. When I wrote to FGE to complain about the delays and awfully packed train back to Liverpool St, and express my understanding disapointment about the 306 I was informed that the 306 should be operating again this year but sadly this doesn't seem to have happened and what with TPWS regulations coming in at the end of this year and all Mk1 stock being banned from the end of next I ddo doubt it will run in passenger service again.

jimbob · Post by **jimbob** » Fri Nov 21, 2003 12:52 am

chriscooper wrote:I managed a trip last time the 306 was running. It was doing Liverpool St - Shenfield in May 2002 (I think), something to do with a steam special that was running from Liverpool St - Norwich. It was suprising just how nice it was to ride on, especially compared to the 315s usually used on that route, and I was amused by the confusion of 'normal' passengers who wern't sure whether they were getting on the right train. One man after being told this was the train he wanted said that he was unsure because it seemed far to posh compared to the normal trains, and was shocked to here it was over 50 years old. It was also due to run later on in 2002 between Manninghtree and Harwich for the Harwich sea festival which I also attended, but sadly after a hellish journey from Loughborough I arrived an hour later than I had planned to find a 312 operating the service (i was pretty pissed of, but had it been this year and a 360 ) as the 306 had failed. This was made worse by the fact that the 312 had no guard so we sat for over an hour until one arrived, making me miss most of the festival. When I wrote to FGE to complain about the delays and awfully packed train back to Liverpool St, and express my understanding disapointment about the 306 I was informed that the 306 should be operating again this year but sadly this doesn't seem to have happened and what with TPWS regulations coming in at the end of this year and all Mk1 stock being banned from the end of next I ddo doubt it will run in passenger service again.

Maybe but it could possibly be ok due to grandfather rights, 312's are allowed to run 12car sets on the southminster branch due to this but 321 & 315's are not! Also I do belive that unless its been retrofitted with one, 306's never had speedo's! The other bit that may allow it is that its not a Mk1 design, it predates that by a good 20 years!

basildd · Post by **basildd** » Fri Nov 21, 2003 9:24 am

There have been other 'informal' posts on the subject but it is planned to have 305/306/308/309/312 units included in a forthcoming EuropeanBahn route project...

jimbob · Post by **jimbob** » Fri Nov 21, 2003 3:13 pm

basildd wrote:There have been other 'informal' posts on the subject but it is planned to have 305/306/308/309/312 units included in a forthcoming EuropeanBahn route project...

Now that sounds promising! LOL, cant wait to see the old girls, on their home turf!

chriscooper · Post by **chriscooper** » Fri Nov 21, 2003 11:43 pm

jimbob wrote:Maybe but it could possibly be ok due to grandfather rights, 312's are allowed to run 12car sets on the southminster branch due to this but 321 & 315's are not! Also I do belive that unless its been retrofitted with one, 306's never had speedo's! The other bit that may allow it is that its not a Mk1 design, it predates that by a good 20 years!

I got a quick look in the cab and their was no speedo that I could see. TPWS I think has to everything though, even steam locos. You might be right though about the fact that it may be allowed to keep running due to it predating the Mk1 design, and if so might mean it would be TPWSed anyway like many mainline certified preserved locos are being. If wouldn't suprise me if this highly political legislation would allow far older, and theroretically less crashworthy, trains that the Mk1s to run in the same way it allows the equally poor Pacers and 313 family units (see the Newton collision where a 303 and 314 suffered near equal damage in a head on collision). At least it has sliding doors do idiots (usually drunk) can't fall out although I wonder how long before window bars have to be added to stop people bashing their brains (if they actually have them) out on trackside objects.

jimbob · Post by **jimbob** » Fri Nov 21, 2003 11:57 pm

chriscooper wrote:
jimbob wrote:Maybe but it could possibly be ok due to grandfather rights, 312's are allowed to run 12car sets on the southminster branch due to this but 321 & 315's are not! Also I do belive that unless its been retrofitted with one, 306's never had speedo's! The other bit that may allow it is that its not a Mk1 design, it predates that by a good 20 years!
I got a quick look in the cab and their was no speedo that I could see. TPWS I think has to everything though, even steam locos. You might be right though about the fact that it may be allowed to keep running due to it predating the Mk1 design, and if so might mean it would be TPWSed anyway like many mainline certified preserved locos are being. If wouldn't suprise me if this highly political legislation would allow far older, and theroretically less crashworthy, trains that the Mk1s to run in the same way it allows the equally poor Pacers and 313 family units (see the Newton collision where a 303 and 314 suffered near equal damage in a head on collision). At least it has sliding doors do idiots (usually drunk) can't fall out although I wonder how long before window bars have to be added to stop people bashing their brains (if they actually have them) out on trackside objects.

I belive that something is on the way about droplight windows, I remember seeing a post on this site, (but cant remember which thread) that said a date when the HSE wants all windows sealed for that very reason. It will in effect end the use of Mk2 & 3 coaches, unless there is a major rebuild or alteration to the handles that open the door, how you get your arm out the window to turn the handle if the window don't open?

jimbob · Post by **jimbob** » Tue Dec 02, 2003 2:00 am

Mind you, slam door could go before this droplight ruling comes in, who knows?!?!

qzdcg8 · Post by **qzdcg8** » Tue Dec 02, 2003 8:29 am

jimbob wrote:Any news on these old girls yet?
I must say that the new 304's do look tip top! Does that mean 305, 308, & 504's are on the way?

To the author of the 304 - find some shots of the 504's - they're very similar except for the panto and thirdrail shoes (obviously)

jimbob · Post by **jimbob** » Sat Jan 03, 2004 3:46 pm

jbilton how you getting on with these old girls, or have they been scrubbed due to being in the pipeline by EuropeanBahn for the route?

jbilton · Post by **jbilton** » Sat Jan 03, 2004 4:47 pm

Yeah sorry but bined the idea over all the flack on the panto...which I could'nt change

Least I got a green 506 out of the process

Riche · Post by **Riche** » Sat Jan 03, 2004 5:13 pm

chriscooper wrote:I managed a trip last time the 306 was running. It was doing Liverpool St - Shenfield in May 2002 (I think), something to do with a steam special that was running from Liverpool St - Norwich. It was suprising just how nice it was to ride on, especially compared to the 315s usually used on that route, and I was amused by the confusion of 'normal' passengers who wern't sure whether they were getting on the right train. One man after being told this was the train he wanted said that he was unsure because it seemed far to posh compared to the normal trains, and was shocked to here it was over 50 years old. It was also due to run later on in 2002 between Manninghtree and Harwich for the Harwich sea festival which I also attended, but sadly after a hellish journey from Loughborough I arrived an hour later than I had planned to find a 312 operating the service (i was pretty pissed of, but had it been this year and a 360 ) as the 306 had failed. This was made worse by the fact that the 312 had no guard so we sat for over an hour until one arrived, making me miss most of the festival. When I wrote to FGE to complain about the delays and awfully packed train back to Liverpool St, and express my understanding disapointment about the 306 I was informed that the 306 should be operating again this year but sadly this doesn't seem to have happened and what with TPWS regulations coming in at the end of this year and all Mk1 stock being banned from the end of next I ddo doubt it will run in passenger service again.

I was at the thing going to the boat show too. I really wantewd to go on the 306. It annoyed me too. Were you the person who on the way back was at the front taping the route for a drivers eye view?

Why would the steam special have affected the 306? There is a fast and a slow line there.