CEPs N CIGs - fao IanM, Coxy, Kerry & Co.....

basildd · Post by **basildd** » Sat Oct 19, 2002 8:36 am

When I were a lad and lived deep in 3rd rail territory, you knew where you were with EMU's..... A Hap was a Hap (not a Sap), A Vep was a Vep (unless it had been made into a Vab), a CEP was a CEP and a CIG was a CIG and you could tell immediately from the profile, what it was....

Then came renumberings and reformations within the Class, so they looked the same but may have a different number.....

...OK, I can cope with that.... They were 73xx and 74xx units when I were little but they got all computerised and were given 12xx and 13xx numbers. Then some became 'Greyhounds' and others didn't so they then became 17xx's and 18xx's as well but lost the 12xx numbers but the Greyhounds kept the 13xx numbers.

That just about made sense, cos at the end of the day, you could still tell from the side profile what it was originally, as you can tell from the above pic.

However.... The above pic was the back of the Unit and next comes a pic of the front. In the past, I have seen temporary reformed units, 7700 was such an example with one CIG driving trailer and three VEP coaches. But 1871 seems to want to go further. It obviously hankers after being a CEP but without changing coaches!

I sometimes wonder if I am losing the plot!

Stooopidperson · Post by **Stooopidperson** » Sat Oct 19, 2002 8:53 am

Well, if you want those trains, a Hap, Sap will be coming.

NickCollier · Post by **NickCollier** » Sat Oct 19, 2002 8:54 am

Sorry Dale, i don't understand your point!

We have 3 COP'S (coridoor open plan) so teh guard could have a better idea of who was on the train, thes were meant to be temporary!
Thats Southcentral for you, we also have veps (vestuble open plan) i think
they are constantly reforming units down our way and SWT should be shot for it!

We get a lot of information sent to us (gen) on WRGEN just subscribe and it sends any reports in from other subscribers from its list server! Thats very intresting, you may want to subscribe some times we get reports of failed locos etc movements, 33108!

Sorry if i buggered up the idea of the thread if so i can delete this post!

Good pics though!

basildd · Post by **basildd** » Sat Oct 19, 2002 9:01 am

No, the point was, I understand all about reformations of different sub-classes of the same units, even total reformations (such as the Ashford - Hastings Class 207's having a CEP trailer in the middle). Just not a CIG driving trailer that pretends its a CEP one by virtue of having the windows changed! And then not all of them - and then only on one side! If it was collision damage, I suspect they would have written the trailer off, plus it would have needed more than just window replacement. If its a mod, why only do one side and why not at least finish the side in question?

Stooopidperson · Post by **Stooopidperson** » Sat Oct 19, 2002 9:17 am

basildd wrote:Just not a CIG driving trailer that pretends its a CEP one by virtue of having the windows changed! And then not all of them - and then only on one side! If it was collision damage, I suspect they would have written the trailer off, plus it would have needed more than just window replacement. If its a mod, why only do one side and why not at least finish the side in question?

You mean the car with windows with silver linings?

NickCollier · Post by **NickCollier** » Sat Oct 19, 2002 9:20 am

I think its a mod Dale, look at the window frames! the last dorr hasnt had the placed in on the look out windows!

and ure not losing the plot!

basildd · Post by **basildd** » Sat Oct 19, 2002 9:24 am

connex wrote:I think its a mod Dale, look at the window frames! the last dorr hasnt had the placed in on the look out windows!

and ure not losing the plot!

I know all about the window frames - I delivered some of the CEP's to Swindon Works for the refurb and new windows to be put in when I was guard many years ago.... Its obvious the windows were removed from a CEP and put into the CIG, just not sure why.....

Stooopidperson · Post by **Stooopidperson** » Sat Oct 19, 2002 9:26 am

You mean there is no silver frame on the first passenger window?

basildd · Post by **basildd** » Sat Oct 19, 2002 9:30 am

????? It certainly appears that way! Thats not the point - the point is they are CEP windows that have been fitted to most of that side of the coach and I just wondered why.....

Stooopidperson · Post by **Stooopidperson** » Sat Oct 19, 2002 9:32 am

How do you know its only that side? You don't have pictures of the other side.

basildd · Post by **basildd** » Sat Oct 19, 2002 1:17 pm

That is possibly the most inane comment I have seen on here this week.... I was travelling on the bloody thing so I am well aware of what was on the other side. Even if I hadn't travelled on it, I would have checked before making such a statement.... The only reason I couldn't get a shot of the other side of the same coach is because it used the sameplatform side at Ashford and at Dover and it was en route elsewhere...

Stooopidperson · Post by **Stooopidperson** » Sat Oct 19, 2002 1:24 pm

basildd wrote: The only reason I couldn't get a shot of the other side of the same coach is because it used the sameplatform side at Ashford and at Dover and it was en route elsewhere...

Then you could go to the opposite platform and take pictures of this train.

NickCollier · Post by **NickCollier** » Sat Oct 19, 2002 2:00 pm

oh leave off!

DaveR · Post by **DaveR** » Sat Oct 19, 2002 3:04 pm

Not sure on this one Dale, most likely due to accident damage, a side swipe of some sort, when I was at Brighton they were having trouble getting sidelight frames, in fact it was hard to get any parts that were not classed as eveyday consumable, as a lot of Cep's have been scrapped there must be an abundance of these sidelight frames, when I was on the railway, 1871 was a Ramsgate based unit.

Dave.

basildd · Post by **basildd** » Sat Oct 19, 2002 3:37 pm

Kerry wrote:Not sure on this one Dale, most likely due to accident damage, a side swipe of some sort, when I was at Brighton they were having trouble getting sidelight frames, in fact it was hard to get any parts that were not classed as eveyday consumable, as a lot of Cep's have been scrapped there must be an abundance of these sidelight frames, when I was on the railway, 1871 was a Ramsgate based unit.

Dave.

That would seem quite logical! Now I wonder if someone wants to update the CIG for MSTS!......