Polite suggestion to stop route builders frm being exploited

madrid · Post by **madrid** » Sun Dec 26, 2004 8:34 am

As we are all aware, some people are starting to take advantage of route builders long efforts and frustration by attempting to resell there work and keep the profits for them selves.

One suggestion I have to the route builders is put up placards/posters at stations or along the route with the writing saying something like:
"This is a prototype freeware route made for the msts commuty, without making a commercial gain".
"If you have paid for this route other than from Atomic Systems please contact me at xxxxx@xxx.com"

So at least now the route builders can start with legal proceedings.

LucaZone · Post by **LucaZone** » Sun Dec 26, 2004 5:43 pm

Instead of putting it on the route itself i reckon it would be far easier to put it on the loading screen of the route. This is something that can be changed I know, but only if you have the MSTS editing tools and Know which file to look for.

It would also mean it is first and foremost to the end user. Rather than if the 'happen' to spot it while running the route.

bigvern · Post by **bigvern** » Sun Dec 26, 2004 7:09 pm

I had thought about including references to the route conditions of distribution, perhaps on a billboard at extreme activity start/finish locations but haven't got round to it yet. I don't think it could be too specific as you never know when you might change or add other sites/methods into the distribution chain.

Maybe the final message on exiting activities too...

qzdcg8 · Post by **qzdcg8** » Sun Dec 26, 2004 11:07 pm

Bury your name and copyright message into custom object textures on the route - I know for a fact this has been done in Mid East and in Woodhead

saddletank · Post by **saddletank** » Mon Dec 27, 2004 2:17 am

With respect Steve, that has no effect on pirates reselling CDs on eBay.

Request to moderators, could this thread be moved to General Discussion please? It's not really a route building subject.

madrid · Post by **madrid** » Mon Dec 27, 2004 7:08 am

The easiest way of amatures to copyrighting their work is:

Before you attempt to upload it/or send the disc to a seller is to put the disc into an enverlope and post it to youself (REGISTERED POST). When you receive your disc do not open up the enverlope as the seal must remain intact, for it to be use in evidence in a court of law.

Now I know this copyright method works for book writers and music composers, but IÂ´m not 100% sure if it would work with software. But IÂ´m sure that their are a few solicitors who like trains out there who read through these forums who could advise.

I donÂ´t like using the term "amatures", as the amatures work that IÂ´ve bought of the years from Atomic is far better than the profeesional commercial work that IÂ´ve bought.

And remember route builders these three letters:

C.Y.A. (cover your behind)

jp4712 · Post by **jp4712** » Mon Dec 27, 2004 8:19 am

Thread moved.

Paul

Caseyjones82 · Post by **Caseyjones82** » Mon Dec 27, 2004 9:03 am

madrid wrote:The easiest way of amatures to copyrighting their work is:

Before you attempt to upload it/or send the disc to a seller is to put the disc into an enverlope and post it to youself (REGISTERED POST). When you receive your disc do not open up the enverlope as the seal must remain intact, for it to be use in evidence in a court of law.

Now I know this copyright method works for book writers and music composers, but IÂ´m not 100% sure if it would work with software. But IÂ´m sure that their are a few solicitors who like trains out there who read through these forums who could advise.

I donÂ´t like using the term "amatures", as the amatures work that IÂ´ve bought of the years from Atomic is far better than the profeesional commercial work that IÂ´ve bought.

And remember route builders these three letters:

C.Y.A. (cover your behind)

most of the "amatures" may well be amatures, but they produce heaps better work than a certain company i have bought products from before. if anyone wants to know who, then pm me, cause i could get into a lot of trouble if i speak out alowed.

i think that the thing to do to stop piracy is just put signs everywhere saying this is a freeware product etc. and if it is on cd from the uktrainsim cd ordering, replace the signs with this route is only to be sold through uk trainsim or something along those lines.

hope u all had a merry xmas, i know i did, raildriver!

happy new year every one,

alex

qzdcg8 · Post by **qzdcg8** » Mon Dec 27, 2004 3:26 pm

saddletank wrote:With respect Steve, that has no effect on pirates reselling CDs on eBay.

Request to moderators, could this thread be moved to General Discussion please? It's not really a route building subject.

Fair do's - but does help if you contact someone after the event and point out the file with your name all over it. I was never in to this to make any money, but if I was I'd be paying the subject far more attention.

MuzTrem · Post by **MuzTrem** » Mon Dec 27, 2004 7:13 pm

Before you attempt to upload it/or send the disc to a seller is to put the disc into an enverlope and post it to youself (REGISTERED POST). When you receive your disc do not open up the enverlope as the seal must remain intact, for it to be use in evidence in a court of law.

Now I know this copyright method works for book writers and music composers, but IÂ´m not 100% sure if it would work with software. But IÂ´m sure that their are a few solicitors who like trains out there who read through these forums who could advise.

Sorry to ask silly questions but I don't see how that works.

TomB · Post by **TomB** » Mon Dec 27, 2004 8:45 pm

MuzTeam:

Say I make a route. I finish it on the 3rd November and sales of the CD start on the 6th November. If someone buys a CD and makes illegal copies of it and claims it is theirs, and you can produce your envelope - which is INTACT - on the front is the postmark (3rd November, which is before 6th November, the 6th being the first day that the pirate's copy could be dated) - open the seal (it being intact proves that the stuff in there *was* there when it was posted and dated) and you have a CD which has the stuff on - therefore you had the CD before anyone else and *they* copied it from *you*, not vice versa as claimed.

Now if he wanted to be crafty, the pirate *could* potentially set his PC's clock back to 3rd November, re-save all the files and burn a new CD, then he'd have to fake a post stamp. Whilst this isn't impossible, for the purposes of our situation (train simulator addons) I very much doubt that *anyone* would go to these lengths!

Post by **NeutronIC** » Mon Dec 27, 2004 8:51 pm

The idea is that if you send something to yourself recorded delivery it gets a date stamp on it and therefore the contents obviously existed at the very least by the date on the envelope.

It helps after the fact if someone is claiming your work to be their own, but doesn't stop people selling it in the first place.

I quite like the idea of a little message on the load screen and the odd banner along the route - the trick is to slot it in cleanly, modern routes you are fairly ok because you can take advantage of the wide range of modern advertising mediums but for older routes you could perhaps leave visible newspapers or something with suitable headlines

We spent boxing day going through all the Cd artwork and all the autorun screens we can change adding "not for resale" to them all, so that's a start, but I do like the idea of embedding it in to the route too.

Matt.

bigvern · Post by **bigvern** » Mon Dec 27, 2004 9:43 pm

Anything in the route definitely has to be done in moderation. 99.9% of the users respect the terms of distribution and having billboards at every milepost saying "Don't sell this route on Ebay" will destroy the mood and could even put the genuine users off future routes from the author. The odd note here and there and certainly the loading screen will get the message across.

saddletank · Post by **saddletank** » Tue Dec 28, 2004 1:49 am

We have been around and around this subject like Pooh and Piglet chasing the woozle round the coppice. We know exactly what to do to protect our copyright. But it's the pirates on e-Bay who ignore everything we do and who just don't care.

madrid · Post by **madrid** » Tue Dec 28, 2004 8:49 am

This is why it must be done by registed post, as yes someone can easily fake a post office ink stamp.
But all registed post when signed for is kept on file by the post office, dated and with the signature from who ever received it.
Law courts also use this effective system to prove that the person has received the summons they have sent it out to.