MSTS vs reality

[seern1]

Living in the US and not having traveled in the UK since early 1960's, I was wondering how closely the physcis of the class 90 EMU's in B-P are? I find them a joy to operate, very responsive, easy to stop right where you want.

[LucaZone]

Little confusion here. Erm the Class 90 is a Locomotive in the UK.


Im guessing by B-P you mean Brighton Portsmouth Express route by Europeanbahn.

The EMU's that come with the route are: 421 CIG & 375 Electrostar

[saddletank]

Any train that stops quickly and 'right where you want it' most likely has suspect physics, unless you've driven it a lot and are used to it's handling when of course it's possible to get any train to stop at a point you aim for

[johndibben]

I too wondered whether this was a compliment and in effect, criticism.

Given it's not even clear what's being discussed apart from it being an EB product, it didn't appear wise to respond as physics is another subject which can cause problems.

[bigvern]

In terms of physics I have to say the ELR stuff hits the spot. Try stopping the Class 47 + Mark One consist from 90 MPH in less than a mile and a half. The rake I was driving last night has had to go for tyre turning as I left the wheels like threepenny bits (or Tesco supermarket trolleys!).

[buffy500]

I would agree that anything which 'feels' like it stops ok, is probably over braked in reality.

But for anyone other than the real die hard rivot counter a compromise is probably the best setting.

[seern1]

Living in the US and not having traveled in the UK since early 1960's...

As I noted...I ment the 421 emu's on the Brighton - Portsmouth. This was not a back handed critism either, just an honest question. I know the compromise on physics we have on North American engines and the ongoing redeaver to come as close to reality as possible. So I am courious as to how close the physics of these units are to reality since they are so enjoyable to run as delivered.

[johndibben]

Not feeling the decelleration forces and 2D view, exact physics would probably make the game tougher than reality.

Therefore it would be unrealistic

[DarwinS]

I have other reasons for supporting the compromise...

...if you arrange things to take about the right distance to stop from high speeds with vacuum brakes, then in MSTS it seems much too difficult to stop them from low speeds...

[seern1]

Interesting discussion so far, but when I started this I lost sight of something know from my model railroading days, realistic vs prototypical. I think here I am referring to the later. So within the constraints of MSTS, do the 2 types of ems's in Brighton Portsmouth provide an experience that gives the feel of operating the real units.

I hope this clarifies the question and not fogs it up some more.

[jbilton]

Interesting discussion so far, but when I started this I lost sight of something know from my model railroading days, realistic vs prototypical. I think here I am referring to the later. So within the constraints of MSTS, do the 2 types of ems's in Brighton Portsmouth provide an experience that gives the feel of operating the real units.

I hope this clarifies the question and not fogs it up some more.

Hi
I think I understand what your after...there was a member who used to drive these things for real.......unfortunately he is not a member any more.
I'm not a southern emu expert ...but it is my understanding that they are fitted with ElectroPneumatic air brakes which are very responsive and forgiving.
I'm afraid I cannot comment on the braking distances involved...but they are designed to run within a very busy communter network....so I would imagine their brakes are pretty good. Acceleration wise...I seem to remember they have a lot of power...and you're aware that your slightly being pushed into your seat, when leaving the station.
Cheers
Jon

[seern1]

Jon,

AS always thanks

[johndibben]

ALL EMU's, and electric units of any kind have excellent acceleration and good braking. The direct power of both being the key.

It's a reason for using electric units globally and any unit on any add-on, could or should reflect this.

I'm sure they do.

It's a simulator and like a model railway, is a representation, not the real thing, otherwise model railways would be 1:1 scale and not models.

Coupled to personal preference, you get what is offered and that will differ.

The quest for ultimate realism is pointless.

The individual items within add-ons can only be 'as real as as one person's perception' .... and nothing more.

[saddletank]

John, I don't think this person is on a quest for ultimate realism, I think he's asking how much like the real units is the power and braking ability of the 321s in the L2B add-on. No one's yet answered his question. Probably because most L2B users don't frequent these forums so much now.

Seern1, you could try asking your question over at the EB forums, http://www.europeanbahn.com they would have the definitive answer.

I have been driving the older slam-door stock issued with the London South East add-on in the last few days and I feel comfortable with the braking and accelerating power of those units (built in the 50s and 60s). I rode these trains many many times in my south London commuter days and am happy that the way the models in the route operate seems about right, not much grunt for top speed but plenty of stopping power, initially slow acceleration but able to pick up speed quickly after that. Braking force is light when you just apply a couple of % but it's enough to bleed your momentum off 3/4 of a mile from a station you are approaching at 50mph, bring in a little more brake (about 5-10%) when you are a train length from the platform and apply up to 15-20% to bring yourself to a stand with your cab at the far end of the platform. In my commuter days some of these stops could be quite fierce (I assumed trainee drivers) so yes these electric commuter units do have powerful brakes.

I don't have the L2B add-on with the modern units so I can't comment on their realism.

[seern1]

Saddletank,

Thanks you.