Correct ways to stop and start

[ightenhill]

Is there anywhere that simply tells me the correct way (lets start with diesels) to start these things and pull away.. It seems Im just doing what I feel is correct but there must be more to it.. As for stopping is there a proper speed etc for approaching the platform etc etc..

[777fred]

Is there anywhere that simply tells me the correct way (lets start with diesels) to start these things and pull away.. It seems Im just doing what I feel is correct but there must be more to it.. As for stopping is there a proper speed etc for approaching the platform etc etc..

Do you mean what key controls?

[ightenhill]

I mean how is it supposed to be operated in real life.. I presume for eg an HST driver doesnt wack it into 100% to pick up speed and leave it there till he hits the speed limit or guesses when and how to start slowing..

[777fred]

I mean how is it supposed to be operated in real life.. I presume for eg an HST driver doesnt wack it into 100% to pick up speed and leave it there till he hits the speed limit or guesses when and how to start slowing..

I guess it is really, when I drive a hst on the oxf-pad route, I wack it (as you say ) to notch 2 which is 40% then when it gets to 10mph it goes to 60 and then I'll gradully make it 80 then 100, til I get to the required speed limit.

[ightenhill]

The reason I mentioned it in the first place was when you use (apologies i forget the model) one of the engines in the Cajon addon the displays in the cab clearly show this is wrong as you basically have an needle going into the red if you push it to hard to start with, I just wondered if it was the same with the UK diesels..

[jp4712]

Yes it is, you should always try to keep the ammeter needle out of the red - this is why diesel engine drivers don't simply 'whack it up' to 100%, it would (a) result in slipping and (b) fry the traction motors.

The way I set off is to release brakes, and watch the brake pressure fall; then ease in a few per cent on the throttle as the brake pressure falls, to ensure the train doesn't roll back; then as you start to move increase throttle, keeping the ammeter needle in the red (and in RS, being aware that field weakening can suddenly jump your ammeter up as you gain speed). That said I'm not averse to momentary creeps into the red for the ammeter, but I assume that temperature in the motors climbs quickly, so I ensure that this is never more than transitory.

Then once I'm happy I'm rolling, I return the brake handle to the 'lap' position (eg in the 47, to about 25%) so that if I need to brake quickly the system will react more promptly.

Now that's the way I drive, never having driven a real one - perhaps some real-life drivers can assist...?

Paul

[phill70]

As an ex-driver here goes

To start of with, the HST.

When starting, you should have the brake at about notch 2, power up to notch 2, then release the brakes, when you are up to about 10-15 mph, you can go to full power (hst's don't have field divert, so you won't go into the red)

Stopping, you need to be doing about 40 mph when you hit the start of the platform, that will give you enough room to stop.

There is no easy way to judge stopping distances, its all down to experience, the more you play with the distances, the better you will get.
I could tell you exactly where to start braking for the oxford route, but that would spoil the fun

Glyn

[ightenhill]

thanks for that Phil..

[phill70]

No problem

47's and 55's are a bit different, because they have field diverts, so you could go into the red, but that's ok but not for long.

[AndyUK]

As an ex-driver here goes

To start of with, the HST.

When starting, you should have the brake at about notch 2, power up to notch 2, then release the brakes, when you are up to about 10-15 mph, you can go to full power (hst's don't have field divert, so you won't go into the red)

Stopping, you need to be doing about 40 mph when you hit the start of the platform, that will give you enough room to stop.

There is no easy way to judge stopping distances, its all down to experience, the more you play with the distances, the better you will get.
I could tell you exactly where to start braking for the oxford route, but that would spoil the fun

Glyn

Thanks for that insight Glyn. Gentle nudge for RSDL - when are you going to implement notched brakes for the HST (and 166) so we can drive them as the expert describes?

Andy L

[ightenhill]

Now all I need is somone to explain when Im suppose to use Loco brakes and Dynamic brakes (which I believe is a bit of a can of worms looking at the US forums) if they did work what do they do?

[AndyUK]

Now all I need is somone to explain when Im suppose to use Loco brakes and Dynamic brakes (which I believe is a bit of a can of worms looking at the US forums) if they did work what do they do?

My layman's understanding is that you use the Loco brake when light engine, and to hold the train prior to departure from a station or other stop , similar to the HST technique described by Glyn, having previously released the train brake which in real life takes a lot longer to release than the loco brake.

Dynamic brakes, which were fixed by the Mk2 upgrade, are used on long down gradients instead of the train brake to save brake wear and overheating. In simple terms they work by using the loco's traction motors as generators, the current from which is passed through resistance grids thereby converting the train's kinetic energy into heat and slowing the train. The "strength" of the braking effect is varied by altering the excitation of the traction motors.

Andy L

[scorpion71]

As an ex-driver here goes

To start of with, the HST.

When starting, you should have the brake at about notch 2, power up to notch 2, then release the brakes, when you are up to about 10-15 mph, you can go to full power (hst's don't have field divert, so you won't go into the red)

Stopping, you need to be doing about 40 mph when you hit the start of the platform, that will give you enough room to stop.

There is no easy way to judge stopping distances, its all down to experience, the more you play with the distances, the better you will get.
I could tell you exactly where to start braking for the oxford route, but that would spoil the fun

Glyn

I used to approach the larger stations (non-terminus) in MSTS/KRS at about 30mph (a bit faster in Electrics!) and thought I was over doing it!!, so stepped down to about 25mph - so HST's approach platforms at approx.40mph in real life!?! BLIMEY!! I'll give that a go, bound to over run the platform

[ightenhill]

I suppose it depends on the approaches speed limits.. But I do recall the good old days (only a couple of years ago) of approaching Preston (head hanging out the door)in the evening in a Virgin HST set and thinking " we're still farely moving"

Now I have more sense and use the east coast route to come home via leeds .. and half the journey time

[phill70]

I used to approach the larger stations (non-terminus) in MSTS/KRS at about 30mph (a bit faster in Electrics!) and thought I was over doing it!!, so stepped down to about 25mph - so HST's approach platforms at approx.40mph in real life!?! BLIMEY!! I'll give that a go, bound to over run the platform

You have to get it right, but it can be done, you have to be braking when you hit the end of the platform, its one way of picking up a bit of time, if you are running late.
a realistic figure from 125 would be about 2.5 miles, emergency about 1.5 miles

In msts, you could hit the end of the platform doing 70 and still stop.