Rail Simulator Content Responsibility Clause (5.4)

[bigvern]

What licenses are written in english? Certainly none that I know of. If they were, most lawyers would be out of business over night! Their sole purpose I thought was to take simple statements and make them incomprehendable to the public.

Nothing needs to be retrospectively applied in light of the clarifications posted. The only likely people to take this license agreement to court over a dispute is RSDL, and we already understand its legalities. However as already demonstrated, we are more than will to assist people if they require further explaination.

The last paragraph totally looses me im affraid, so I cannot respond to what ever it is getting at.

Surely the licence should be as clear as possible - with all due respect that answer is a bit lacking Adam. You state that RSDL might well take people to court in the event of a breach, so all the more reason why posting clarifications or caveats on a forum without appending or minuting to the actual licence is not really a sufficient response.

My final paragraph meant exactly what it said! Let's see where the RS payware and freeware scene is in six months time. If it's alive and kicking and everyone is happy (including the payware devs paying between their £0 and £1000 fee per item) then perhaps it will have been a load of fuss over nothing. If not then maybe, just maybe, it will be the licence arrangements that have taken the edge off the whole thing.

[mickoo737]

What licenses are written in english? Certainly none that I know of. If they were, most lawyers would be out of business over night! Their sole purpose I thought was to take simple statements and make them incomprehendable to the public.

Nothing needs to be retrospectively applied in light of the clarifications posted. The only likely people to take this license agreement to court over a dispute is RSDL, and we already understand its legalities. However as already demonstrated, we are more than will to assist people if they require further explaination.

The last paragraph totally looses me im affraid, so I cannot respond to what ever it is getting at.

Surely the licence should be as clear as possible - with all due respect that answer is a bit lacking Adam. You state that RSDL might well take people to court in the event of a breach, so all the more reason why posting clarifications or caveats on a forum without appending or minuting to the actual licence is not really a sufficient response.

My final paragraph meant exactly what it said! Let's see where the RS payware and freeware scene is in six months time. If it's alive and kicking and everyone is happy (including the payware devs paying between their £0 and £1000 fee per item) then perhaps it will have been a load of fuss over nothing. If not then maybe, just maybe, it will be the licence arrangements that have taken the edge off the whole thing.

Vern, if RS fails from either freeware or payware it wont be the fault of the license, it'll be the fault of the community members who complained and pitch forked the game into the castle keep, your not going to win this one my friend, let them have there day and let them be smug with it.

l'm sure the fee 'waivering' is possibly illigal and it would be interesting to see what criteria they set for a waivered fee, its a bit like being asked to play a game but not being told 'all' the rules.

[RSAdam]

Reitterating my point from earlier:

What is it that some people think are the real motives behind RSDL?

Clearly what ever we say in any frame of mind and under any circumstances is not good enough for some people. We are all interested to know what it is you think we're trying to do here? Maybe then we can put some doubts to bed and get on with enjoying train simulation.

[bigvern]

Vern, if RS fails from either freeware or payware it wont be the fault of the license, it'll be the fault of the community members who complained and pitch forked the game into the castle keep, your not going to win this one my friend, let them have there day and let them be smug with it.

l'm sure the fee 'waivering' is possibly illigal and it would be interesting to see what criteria they set for a waivered fee, its a bit like being asked to play a game but not being told 'all' the rules.

I think you are right Mick...
Whatever happened to that banging head against brick wall smilie

[mickoo737]

Vern, if RS fails from either freeware or payware it wont be the fault of the license, it'll be the fault of the community members who complained and pitch forked the game into the castle keep, your not going to win this one my friend, let them have there day and let them be smug with it.

l'm sure the fee 'waivering' is possibly illigal and it would be interesting to see what criteria they set for a waivered fee, its a bit like being asked to play a game but not being told 'all' the rules.

I think you are right Mick...
Whatever happened to that banging head against brick wall smilie

Or the one where you shoot yourself in the head, you know, I just dont know how Salmon do it, must be made of sterner stuff.

[drwho200]

Well said Adam,

my answer,

RSDL is trying to create a great game playable by everyone enthusiast or not. The RSDL team is a group of real friendly people wanting to create an appealing game without being criticized for every move they take.

[bigvern]

Now I need the sick bucket...

[RSAdam]

Maybe I should add:

Clearly we dont expect to please everyone.... but we'll try!

[KlausM]

Klaus,

What is it that you think are the real motives behind RSDL?

Clearly what ever we say in any frame of mind and under any circumstances is not good enough for you. We are all interested to know what it is you think we're trying to do here? Maybe then we can put some doubts to bed and get on with enjoying train simulation.

I am trying to figure that out for two years now. Originally I thought this would be to develop the world's best* simulator.

Klaus

* in respect to what is possible as a "gaming product", versus a specialized, high-end simulator, of course

[stewart]

Where was the vote or poll that made you judge advocate over what people write or express here ?

Probably in the same place as the vote or poll that gave you authority to tell others which discussions they should or rather should not enter into on these forums. Your reaction to my post tends to suggest that you seem to think my post was aimed at you personally but I didnt name any names. Actually I don't think I have to. Suffice to say if the cap fits, wear it. Have a good day.

[fgrsimon]

OK guys with my Moderator's hat on - let's keep our tempers here before someone says something they will regret. All comments positive and negative are allowed on these Forums and as long as it doesn't descend into personal abuse or insults then it's fine. The only way that this Sim will progress is with a balance of views. It is not up to individual members to say what others are allowed to post or not.

[AndiS]

Nothing needs to be retrospectively applied in light of the clarifications posted. The only likely people to take this license agreement to court over a dispute is RSDL, and we already understand its legalities. However as already demonstrated, we are more than will to assist people if they require further explaination.

Surely the licence should be as clear as possible - with all due respect that answer is a bit lacking Adam. You state that RSDL might well take people to court in the event of a breach, so all the more reason why posting clarifications or caveats on a forum without appending or minuting to the actual licence is not really a sufficient response.

My point exactly. You made us sign a contract which sounded harsh and which said that no other details can be added to it, it is only this contract which counts. Then you post in the forums that it is half as bad.

Even if this is common practice, it is bad practice to put the thumb on those with the smaller law budget.

I do appreciate your clarifications, but I do not understand why you refuse to but the whole friendly truth into the stupid contract, which says of itself that only itself counts. Sure, you will have to double-check with the law department and that, but if everyone accepts their folly, then they will go on till doomsday.

I for one very much appreciate to see the complete questionnaire which I have to fill in just in case anything is considered payware, right at project start, so I can send it in in time - registered mail can take a few days. The my of KRS took 6 days to arrive here. So if you ask me anything, I am poised to fail to comply. Aliens, pay £1000 or life near Surrey in the time before release, says the lawyer. Not a good joke in my book.

[RSderek]

AndiS, please calm yourself.

Neither Adam nor I had any say what went into the contract you all signed, seemingly without understanding it.

Perhaps it be best if Both Adam and I retreated from these forums for a few days while everyone simmers down. I'm really not sure why such heat has been generated or why RSDL have come under attack in such a manner from some people.

regards

Derek

[mickoo737]

Actually I don't think I have to. Suffice to say if the cap fits, wear it.

My cap fits fine thank you, I just dont like people telling me to take it off or change it thats all.

Have a good day

And you to

Michael

[drwho200]

I don't think I would rest while there are still good people here for you. I think you have done a great job and just keep going. There maybe some people that are angry about the Dev Tools on this Forum but I am not.