Hull Trains Pioneer 222103 damaged

[n863dwt]

well long term they are either gonna need to sort the 2x damaged vehicles or they will need to replace them.....
otherwise the hire of a hst or a 67 and LHCS could well run beyond any sensible price...

[allypally]

They aren't fixable, and even long term hire might be more cost effective than building new vehicles for a while!

[n863dwt]

They aren't fixable, and even long term hire might be more cost effective than building new vehicles for a while!

depends.
i mean if hull trains finally take the decision to order extra vehicles for the 222's ie a 5th carraige that would perhaps work out best for all parties as hull trains would get the 2 replaced carraiges, plus the new carraiges and bombardier would get some funds for the cost of having to re open the production line

[johncard]

Depending on passenger numbers, maybe they could temporarily form 2 3-car sets by taking a centre car from another set and inserting between the surviving driving cars, using the 4-car set on the busiest service(s)?

John

[AlistairW]

A front carriage would still need the coupling/cab unit etc.

[mattvince]

Well, Hull Trains are apparently down to 2 sets for tomorrow, as another 222/1 is being moved to Ilford for urgent tyre-turning. So, that's 2 sets to cover 3 diagrams designed for a fleet of four units.

[petermakosch]

May open up the interesting possibility of extra vehicles being made for the Voyager's if they have to re-open the bodyshell production line to build the two replacements.

I thought this was the plan anyway as Virgin wanted some extra coaches but were annoyed as they had to wait until the order with Hull Trains' trains were done first?

[andylloyd]

from what i've read on railway center. Hull trains are looking to hire a 67 set complete with dvt.

Andy

[chriscooper]

I wonder how that would work for timetabling and pathing. The Mk3 DVTs are only certified to 110mph since although capable of 125mph running, they were never certified since there was never a need to run them above 110 when on the WCML, due to it being the maximum speed of the line and the locos. The coaches are 125mph capable though, since they didn't need seperate certification from the HST trailers. Another problem is that a 67+4+DVT, or worse 67+5+DVT isn't going to have anything like the performance of a Pioneer, infact I don't think they would even be up to HST standards. The ideal solution would be a short formed (2+5) HST, since they could keep up to Pioneer timings (as they did on Cross Country for a while), but there is a shortage of HSTs at the moment. The idea of top and tail 67s seems most interesting, since it would give good performance, but it would still need somewhere for the guard, so either a DVT (and 110mph) or one of the 3 Mk3B BFOs (if available) would have to be used. There is also a possible issue of speed restrictions due to lower brake force when top and tailing short sets.

[phat2003uk]

There's so much recovery time though on Hull Trains' services due to them having to fit in with GNER who seem to get priority.

[petermakosch]

^ Midland Mainline always has a HST set spare - they were supposed to lend it to Virgin and Virgin lend a Voyager to Hull Trains.
Damn complicated if you ask me!

[ForburyLion]

I thought Hull Trains were a First company?

Maybe the solution is to have the insurance company write the set off and get an Adelante from First Great Western who can in turn get another HST.