Atomic Systems

In the Leicester Mercury they said Midland Mainline are giving up next year so who do you thinck will take over

Also they said St Pancrass wont be big enough for all the international passangers so thers another . up they should of made it bigger

I assume this is likley connected to the re-structuring of franchises that has been talked about.

The Sheffield / Derby / Nottingham to St Pancras was proposed to come under a new East Midlands Franchise, along with some Central Citylink and VXC routes.

As for St Pancras not being big enough - I think it would be fine. Its a huge shed, with wide platforms. So long as it's well designed, it should work a treat

Cheers

Gaz

Midland Mainline is being reshaped to combine with the East Midlands portion of Central Trains. It's not a question of Midland Mainline Ltd 'giving up' - simply that the franchise is due to terminate in April 2008. The refranchising battle will start in earnest next year - and one can assume that National Express, if it still exists, will be bidding. I don't think any 'XC' routes will go to East Midlands. The Citylinks east of Nottingham towards Norwich could go to East Mids, but other than that, the rest of the Citylinks will go to Cross-Country.

St Pancras will be big enough - since when was SIX (count 'em!) 400 metre long platforms not big enough?

Since when did the Leicester Mercury become a mighty, authoratitive tome on all things 'railway'?

St Pancras is not big enough... fact. I'm not sure if it is still 6 platforms for MML but by the time of completion MML will only have 4 designated platforms. Off peak services require 4 arrivals and 4 departures an hour, including turn around time. Trains can no longer lye idle in platforms they have to be stabled 4 or 5 miles North, you can see them as you approach St Pancras. Much like Kings X, St P is nearing being full, it is no longer a big shed, and the platforms aren't wide or particularly long once a HST set is parked in one.

Personally I think MML have been worked into a hole, and in 5 years time, with CTRL 2 being completed and the regeneration of the Kings X area trains and tracks will have passed their capacity. Yet again there’s been a short-term fix with a lack of thought for the future.

AlistairW wrote:St Pancras is not big enough... fact. I'm not sure if it is still 6 platforms for MML but by the time of completion MML will only have 4 designated platforms. Off peak services require 4 arrivals and 4 departures an hour, including turn around time. Trains can no longer lye idle in platforms they have to be stabled 4 or 5 miles North, you can see them as you approach St Pancras. Much like Kings X, St P is nearing being full, it is no longer a big shed, and the platforms aren't wide or particularly long once a HST set is parked in one.

Personally I think MML have been worked into a hole, and in 5 years time, with CTRL 2 being completed and the regeneration of the Kings X area trains and tracks will have passed their capacity. Yet again there’s been a short-term fix with a lack of thought for the future.

only dference is tat kings cross has a larger capacity in the train shed
i mean what... 8 platforms in the main shed
mml may be sole operator from st. pancras but its still got no potention capacity for growth.
especially not once the ctrl domestics are running

Recently in both magazines and in the papers and government all the hypes been about how good it would be to have a HSL, but the real strings have been tightened around on MML they really need a new storeage facility built to the side say the former KX goods yard would have worked if it had been designed better but alas it is how it is and St Pancreas may be a thing of the past unless more thought is given to MML.

MML do have capacity for growth - out of those four arrivals/departures each hour, two are operated by Class 222 units. If they're still running around as 4-cars on those, then there is the ability to provide additional capacity simply by adding extra vehicles. There is the option of recasting the timetable: as performance improves, it may be possible for turnaround times at St Pancras to be cut, thereby freeing up platforms to enable additional services to run.

Run proper length trains? that's a novel solution. It'll never catch on. Considering the amount of money being spent on St Pancras, I doubt anyone will want egg on their faces in 3 years when it needs rebuilding again! On that basis, I'd say it's probably been planned to cater for growth.

Remember that the current terminus of the MML is not where it will ultimately be located - the place they're using now will be the CTRL Domestic terminal, and the MML will terminate on the Euston side of the Barlow shed.

And if they only have 4 platforms, that should be ample for a 4 trains/hour scenario. You could theoretically have 55 minute turn arounds, which should be long enough to empty the bins and fill up the urns, even with a terrifically slack workforce.

More capacity you could coupple two meridian sets togather providing you have a gaurd in both sets or run larger 8 car sets and as for the current station oing to be the CTRL domestic terminal where will the international trains go from

St Pancras will become a station of three parts (well, four if you count the Thameslink box). The East side, the present interim MML station, will become a 3-platform 240m station for South Eastern CTRL Domestics in 2009. The centre part, under the Barlow roof, is to be six 400m long International platforms for 2007. The Western side is to be four 240m platforms for Midland Mainline.

arabiandisco - I have to agree on the turnaround times: for a four-car Meridian, 20-25 minutes from arriving to departing back north should be reasonable. Anything longer is simply leaving expensive 'assets' lying idle - although anything shorter could present performance risks.