People don't seem to try anymore!!!

[Frellis]

I don't know about you guys but I for one am tired of going to model rail shows and paying good money to see layouts with locos and rolling stock which is straight-out-of-the-box. No attempt to renumber them and the worst part is that they don't weather them!!! We all know that locos did not stay pristine for very long, so why don't they do it?

When I take either of my layouts to a show the public are treated to a dose of realism. All locos and stock are weathered, no tension-lock couplings on wagons (all three-link and screw where applicable) and I use real coal loads in locos, real coal and iron ore in wagons where applicable.

Should we have to fork out our hard-earned dosh to see what can see in a model shop shelf for free? I admit most of those people do a good job on the scenic work mostly but for me this really ruins the total effect for me.

What are your thoughts on this?

cheers
FRED

[Frellis]

By the way, I do realise that there are many people at shows who do make an effort and to them I am eternally greatful.

Cheers
FRED

[RobertM]

Thats abit harsh

Maybe they dont know how too weather locos & rolling stock (I sure dont), and when I finaly get around too getting my layout too exibitions I'm not going too realy focus on the trains

As long as the rolling stock is set during the correct era I dont realy care that much.

RobertM

[seamermodelrailway]

I don't know about you guys but I for one am tired of going to model rail shows and paying good money to see layouts with locos and rolling stock which is straight-out-of-the-box. No attempt to renumber them and the worst part is that they don't weather them!!! We all know that locos did not stay pristine for very long, so why don't they do it?

When I take either of my layouts to a show the public are treated to a dose of realism. All locos and stock are weathered, no tension-lock couplings on wagons (all three-link and screw where applicable) and I use real coal loads in locos, real coal and iron ore in wagons where applicable.

Should we have to fork out our hard-earned dosh to see what can see in a model shop shelf for free? I admit most of those people do a good job on the scenic work mostly but for me this really ruins the total effect for me.

What are your thoughts on this?

cheers
FRED

Weathering:-

Personally I think some things look better when weathered than others, so it's all personal choice. With the standards and higher prices of today's loco's and stock available, I'm not surprised people don't mess about with them. For example, I won't be touching my new Hornby Loadhaul Class 60 apart from the detailing bits.

Re-numbering and modifying:-

First of all, what is the point? It's a number! Why pay loads of money for a brand new loco' and start changing it to one number higher than what it originally came with?!

Fair enough if there is some significant difference such as a name or other details, but when you get right down to it; a number is a number.

Most people don't have the time, money or patience to convert to smaller couplings and other such things. Smaller couplings aren't exactly essential are they? They may look better, but I wouldn't fancy trying to change all my couplings! There's too many of them!

All the little things (such as close couplers) are fine if you're an old timer who's retired with 100% of their time to devote to the hobby, but a lot of exhibitionists are just ordinary working class folk with a hobby.

As for saying "...I for one am tired of going to model rail shows and paying good money to see layouts with locos and rolling stock which is straight-out-of-the-box..." You could stop going for a while?

However, I think some shows are bordering on the expensive in terms of entrance fee now!

[demonshadow]

im going to add a little for my pennys worth,

Renumbering is worth it wether it be a new model or not, your not actually thinking of running the same model in double header fashion are you? people will renumber a model for many reasons, perhaps they want a loco that means something to them cause they have seen it many a time. or like in my case, i have been renumbering my loco's to preserved one's i.e hornbys b12 is now 61572, bach B1 now 61264 etc.

Weathering, it does add a sort of realism to it thats for sure, wether the model is new or not i'll weather it if i have too, how ever my steam locos and preserved diesels wont be weathered as their preserved, how ever the rest will.

at the end of the day it all comes down to personal preferance, some people know how to do it and others dont, some people seek realism, others dont and just find enjoyment in playing trains, its different for all of us, me personally i'd rather see realism in model form.

well im finished and got my pennys worth maybe even a full sterling!

From Mike

[seamermodelrailway]

im going to add a little for my pennys worth,

Renumbering is worth it wether it be a new model or not, your not actually thinking of running the same model in double header fashion are you? people will renumber a model for many reasons, perhaps they want a loco that means something to them cause they have seen it many a time.

I fully agree.

I wouldn't dream of running the same number as a double header, but I run modern image so I never have double headers anyway .

As for trains special to you, I actually have a particular soft spot for Transpennine Express's 158750, sad as it sounds.

I also ehco your point about this whole subject being down to personal choice, as I said in my first post.

[47522]

I find that you spend sometimes £100 + on a model

The last thing you want to do is . it up with a weathering mistake!

[02southeranc]

I like to see detailed/weathered stock but I don't object to see out-of-the-box stock running particularly.
Sometimes weathering looks really wrong and just a mess (in the wrong sense!)

[mpeffers]

I find that you spend sometimes £100 + on a model

The last thing you want to do is . it up with a weathering mistake!

I totally agree.

(more) On topic, it's their layout and they can run what they like on it. With the standard of today's RTR models, I've seen a few models around that'd look better without being renumbered/weathered.

At the end of the day, every layout that I've seen at exibitions has had years of hard work go into it. I'm sure they'd object to 'not trying'. If you think you get the same enjoyment from your local model shop, then go there instead of moaning about the price of exibitions.

[trains2]

I don't know about you guys but I for one am tired of going to model rail shows and paying good money to see layouts with locos and rolling stock which is straight-out-of-the-box. No attempt to renumber them and the worst part is that they don't weather them!!! We all know that locos did not stay pristine for very long, so why don't they do it?

When I take either of my layouts to a show the public are treated to a dose of realism. All locos and stock are weathered, no tension-lock couplings on wagons (all three-link and screw where applicable) and I use real coal loads in locos, real coal and iron ore in wagons where applicable.

Should we have to fork out our hard-earned dosh to see what can see in a model shop shelf for free? I admit most of those people do a good job on the scenic work mostly but for me this really ruins the total effect for me.

What are your thoughts on this?

cheers
FRED

It's their stock, they can do what they want with it. I'd say at least 90% of people who attend a model railway show would not be discouraged from going again because a few layouts do not please their idea of what stock should look like.

There is so much more to a layout than just stock; you could have the best most amazingly weathered stock on a layout, but if the scenic areas of the layout are naff, or the operational interest is not inspiring, or there are so many problems with it that it is just boring to watch, then it lets everything down. Whereas if I saw a layout which was excellent at all the above mentioned, and some, if not all the stock was RTR out of the box, it wouldn't deter me from visiting the stand, let alone standing there for a good few minutes and watching.

Regards

Rich

[MuzTrem]

You have to remember that different people prioritise different aspects of modelling. Some find scenic modelling the most satisfying aspect of the hobby, and aren't so worried about an engines number as long as the scenery they travel through is accurate. Others aren't so fussed about scenry because they love running railways to an intensive timetable, so their priority is to get as much track as possible onto the baseboard, and so on and so forth.
Weathered locos aren't always appropriate-preserved lines, for example, keep their engines in pristine condition. Three-link couplings may look pretty, but from an operational point of view they are totally impractical, especially if you want to couple rolling stock on the public side of the layout. I've seen layouts where the hand of God reaches down from the sky with a massive shunter's pole-and if that's not unprototypical, I don't know what is! And as for re-numbering locos, at the end of the day only those with a very deep knowledge of the prototype will notice if an engine has the wrong number or shedplate, and for double headers most manufacturers now offer a choice of numbers.
I'm not a rivet counter-TBH I'm not really fussed that I'm running an out-of-the-box RTR engine pulling squeakingly clean coaches with tension lock couplings on a line that has almost no scale scenery. I just enjoy the simple pleasure of driving a live steam locomotive in my garden. WHen I go to exhibitions and see minutely detailed layouts, I remember that their creators gained just as much pleasure from counting rivets as I do from ignoring them altogheter-and I think, Frellis, you would do well to remember that too.

[47522]

But does it not put you off when you see a guy that has tried but done a really really . job?

The last show i went to there was a Hornby 50 (great looking model) and it looked like the guy had tipped a pot of black paint over the roof!:puppydogeyes: and dipped the rest of the model into a tub of outdoor woodtreatment!
It was gloss tooo!!!

Made me feel a bit sorry for the guy!

I

[JonPotter]

I was running on a large 16mm line the other day and there was a wooden wagon painted in metallic silver.
You have to remember everyone has to start somewhere.

As far as I'm concerned if people are buying railway stuff that means that they're interested - which is all you have to ask for really. Getting annoyed isn't going to help

[LNERandBR]

you have to remember that the joe public arnt interensted in weather a loco is weathereed or not to them everything on the rails is a train.

At the Boston MRS on our exhibition layout we run everything and anything. Most of my stock is weathered but some other members stock is not so on our layout you may see my weathered class 40 along side a pristeen class 40. As long as there is something running on the front of the layout it will keep the public entertained.

[NeutronIC]

IMHO...

I like a layout to have nice scenery, weathered stock is nice - but the absolute most important aspect for me is the quality of the operations and how well the design of the layout lends itself to interesting operations.

For me, if the layout is mostly not doing anything in the visible portion, or if it's just a different train whizzing past every couple of minutes then I quickly lose interest once i've admired some the scenic work. Similarly, layouts with platforms and trains that never stop at them irk me more than layouts without platforms.

An ideal design for me would have a mainline and a yard, or a mainline with a branch or something like that - so that while you've got some high speed stuff that occasionally stops, you've always got some thing going on in the background to keep your interest between the high speed trains. Indeed, some of the most interesting layouts i've seen have had some shunting going on which forms a train that then leaves via the main line, another one comes in and is broken up in to the yard and so forth, really interacting between the two.

Along similar lines, poor running quality of stock or track, jumping about all over the place or needing an 0-5-0 shunter (hand) to push it along and get it working again.

When it comes to stopping and starting, I like to see prototypical starts and stops - not just leaping away or sliding to a halt as many do.

There are some really gorgeous layouts that are spoiled by a lack of planning on the operations front, I can (and have) sit and watch a well run layout for hours.

Matt.